The Poor Mans Behike?

[Rock Star]

interesting bro, i dont even think the real thing is all that though. hope those are better. i mean, dont get me wrong, im sure the behikes will be good sooner or later

[CasaDooley]

So what is wrong with capitalism and free enterprise? I don't smoke a lot of PJ's stuff, but, he has the right to do what he wants with his company, doesn't he?
I'll give his new line a try when they are released.

Originally Posted by CasaDooley

So what is wrong with capitalism and free enterprise? I don't smoke a lot of PJ's stuff, but, he has the right to do what he wants with his company, doesn't he?
I'll give his new line a try when they are released.

It's not an issue with Capitalism at all. The issue, at least for me, is the marketing and packaging he chooses to deliver his product.

[DaBear]

Originally Posted by ChicagoWhiteSox

It's not an issue with Capitalism at all. The issue, at least for me, is the marketing and packaging he chooses to deliver his product.

So what you're saying is you believe the CC Cohiba to be in the right? You know, despite the fact that the current CC Cohiba brand was entirely stolen from the now Dominican Cohiba that fled during the revolution. You should be bashing most, if not all, Cuban marcas for stealing company names, sizes, and even blends from pre-revolution Cuban marcas.

All I'm saying is trying to defend CC marcas like they're something holy that can't be touched from NCs that are using similar sizes and ideas is hypocritical at best. Especially defending a company like Cohiba, which stole EVERYTHING from the pre-revolution Cohiba that still exists in the Dominican.



I'll grab some of these when the come out. Will be interesting to try to say the least.

[icehog3]

Originally Posted by DaBear

So what you're saying is you believe the CC Cohiba to be in the right? You know, despite the fact that the current CC Cohiba brand was entirely stolen from the now Dominican Cohiba that fled during the revolution.

Originally Posted by CubanCigarWebsite

Cohiba is a current post-revolution brand, established in 1966.
It is classified by Habanos SA as their Global flagship brand, and has a major market share and is sold at a premium price.

The Cuban Revolution took place from 1953-1958, so I am not sure how a marca establsihed in 1966 could have been stolen from anyone in pre-revolutionary Cuba.

[Dunkel]

I can't believe that I agree with PT. Nic cigars are better than CC's all day everyday.

[OLS]

I am always cranked off when I see anyone even tilt towards Cuba with their marketing, or use it as a reference point
for comparison. These guys are in a death struggle everyday with havana, and from what I can tell, Habanos goes out
of their way to be innovative within themselves. Granted, EVERYTHING THEY OWN, they STOLE, but since then they
have tried to stay above the fray and just focus on trying to maintain their image as the best in the world. They have
failed mightily at every turn in my opinion, their reaction to the boom was not only embarrassing, it was nearly
catastrophic. But they still keep innovating and trying to shake the money tree. EVERY OTHER MAKER outside of Cuba
uses them for ideas to steal, an anchor for all their legitimacy in the history of their companies or in the DNA of their
master blenders and torcedores. It's almost disgusting, and I try to stay away from their products as much as possible.
But again, Havana DID steal EVERYTHING. But they did not continue to steal unabashedly.
I can tolerate Fuente because no one can say they don't also do it their way, and are wildly successful because of it.
The Padrons live off the cuban mystique, but they also innovate on their own and are a dominant force because they
refuse to pander to trends. They MAKE trends. It seems like all the boutiques will steal whatever they can to try and
just get the scraps left behind by the other 2. I like a Nic cigar, but I don't like the PJ stuff, or the Drew Estates Stuff,
or the Pepin stuff or the AJ stuff......Some of the cigars make the most they can out of the tobacco, but 80% of it is all the
same to me.

By the way OP, "poor man's Behike" is a little off base....These cigars will be money or nothing. They won't be cheap.

[neoflex]

Originally Posted by OLS

I like a Nic cigar, but I don't like the PJ stuff, or the Drew Estates Stuff, or the Pepin stuff or the AJ stuff......Some of the cigars make the most they can out of the tobacco, but 80% of it is all the
same to me..

You clearly don't like Nicaraguan tobacco as much as you claim as you basically just eliminated the best in the biz in Nicaragua. Everyone you just listed are some of the only ones doing anything worthwhile with the tobacco and is the reason why when it comes to boutiques they are the top dogs.
Is it a rip off? Yes, but I am sure if you talk to Pete there is probably some kind of joke behind it. I always laugh at how many people love to hate on his stuff and the man himself, many without even trying his stuff or ever meeting him. I can almost guarantee if you spend a little time talking to him in person your opinion would more than likely change. Just when it comes to tobacco the guy is a wealth of knowledge and probably has forgotten more than I myself would ever know. I personally will pick up a few to try. I will never rule out a stick due to marketing gimmicks. Hell if that were the case I would have never smoked a good amount of sticks I enjoy everyday. Sh*t if it weren't for marketing gimmicks I would be out of a job! Call me biased but I would take any of the brands OLS mentioned above over most Cubans anyway. I actually just had this conversation two nights ago about this topic. I said "If someone had a Tatuaje, Liga and a Monte 2 in their hand and offered me to take one for free, the Monte would be my last choice." Not that it isn't a good smoke but I personally prefer Nic. tobacco and I also know I have a 50/50 chance that the Monte will be plugged.
Things could be worse. Has anyone seen Casa De Montecristos claims on their copy of the Behike. They're claiming theirs even tastes the same.
http://www.topqualitycigars.com/ Should still be on the homepage but if it moves after landing on the page search for B56.

[maninblack]

I for one am excited. He makes a great product and is a master at marketing his product. And I tend to agree with Dunkel. NC's blow the doors off CC's. Let the debate continue.

Originally Posted by maninblack

I for one am excited. He makes a great product and is a master at marketing his product. And I tend to agree with Dunkel. NC's blow the doors off CC's. Let the debate continue.

He makes a great product? That's debatable, but goes back to smoke what you like, a subjective type of thing. Master of marketing? I don't think so, he steals everything he puts out from Cuba.. boxes, bands, ect.

NC's blow the doors off CC's? That's subjective also, smoke what you like. However, I will smoke what I like too, and I prefer not to smoke nasty, harsh, one dimensional spice bombs that most NC's are. I prefer the opposite

[AlohaStyle]

Originally Posted by ChicagoWhiteSox

Master of marketing? I don't think so, he steals everything he puts out from Cuba.. boxes, bands, ect.

What do people think about the Cohiba Count Draculas? I haven't read any reviews of the Bolivar Boris. I really love the Farm Vintage 2009 Partagas where all the tobacco came from one farm. Oh wait, there aren't any cuban cigars like this... how could've Pete sold his Monsters and La Verite's then?

I can understand people having an opinion, but this "debate" is so old already... why get yourself worked up, over this of all things??? If you don't like something, why keep bringing it up over and over? Maybe express your opinion once to get it off your chest and then be done with it and live a happier life.

Everyone has an opinion so I could care less if people don't like what Pete is doing. But the simple fact is cuban cigars are illegal in the US so why not take ideas from what they are doing and recreate it in the US? If a business owner sees a good idea and knows it sells, why would they not want to do something like that for themselves?

Examples in other industries:
- Coke comes out with a new style of plastic bottle or top that sells well. Should Pepsi say "oh we better not steal Coke's idea"... hell no, they will make their own.

- Samsung develops WiFi inside their TV's. Should Sony not put WiFi in their tv's because another company already did it? Hell no.

- Mercedes develops a rear facing video camera for when driving in reverse. Should other manufacturers not install cameras because Mercedes did it first? Hell no.


So why should the cigar industry be any different? An argument could be that these are technology changes and not marketing, but I could cite many examples of marketing strategies/ideas copied as well. In the cigar industry, there really can't be many technology changes so a good portion of sales is all about the marketing and having a good blend of tobacco. Not much room to play except driving good packaging and marketing.

Like other wise men say... smoke what you like. Why let the things you don't like bother you? Just move on...

Originally Posted by AlohaStyle

What do people think about the Cohiba Count Draculas? I haven't read any reviews of the Bolivar Boris. I really love the Farm Vintage 2009 Partagas where all the tobacco came from one farm. Oh wait, there aren't any cuban cigars like this... how could've Pete sold his Monsters and La Verite's then?

I can understand people having an opinion, but this "debate" is so old already... why get yourself worked up, over this of all things??? If you don't like something, why keep bringing it up over and over? Maybe express your opinion once to get it off your chest and then be done with it and live a happier life.

Everyone has an opinion so I could care less if people don't like what Pete is doing. But the simple fact is cuban cigars are illegal in the US so why not take ideas from what they are doing and recreate it in the US? If a business owner sees a good idea and knows it sells, why would they not want to do something like that for themselves?

Examples in other industries:
- Coke comes out with a new style of plastic bottle or top that sells well. Should Pepsi say "oh we better not steal Coke's idea"... hell no, they will make their own.

- Samsung develops WiFi inside their TV's. Should Sony not put WiFi in their tv's because another company already did it? Hell no.

- Mercedes develops a rear facing video camera for when driving in reverse. Should other manufacturers not install cameras because Mercedes did it first? Hell no.


So why should the cigar industry be any different? An argument could be that these are technology changes and not marketing, but I could cite many examples of marketing strategies/ideas copied as well. In the cigar industry, there really can't be many technology changes so a good portion of sales is all about the marketing and having a good blend of tobacco. Not much room to play except driving good packaging and marketing.

Like other wise men say... smoke what you like. Why let the things you don't like bother you? Just move on...

Don't forget IP laws

[Brandon]

If his crap is so great, how come he has to rip off the Cubans for his marketing and packaging? Why does he have to imitate such an inferior product??? He does this because his sh*t can't stand on its own. He needs the hype in order to draw attention to his product.

Oh, BTW... I think your wife is a dog. It's only a coincidence that I make my wife dress the same and wear the same makeup.

[CasaDooley]

Is it just me, or has anybody else noticed that whenever a thread is started about Pete Johnson and his lines of cigars, it turns into a slugfest?

[CigarNut]

Originally Posted by Brandon

If his crap is so great, how come he has to rip off the Cubans for his marketing and packaging? Why does he have to imitate such an inferior product??? He does this because his sh*t can't stand on its own. He needs the hype in order to draw attention to his product.

Oh, BTW... I think your wife is a dog. It's only a coincidence that I make my wife dress the same and wear the same makeup.

Companies do this all the time with competing products. Many people when asked about cigars first think of Cuba. That makes Cuba a target.

Instead of looking at this as a bad thing you could choose to look at it as "Imitation is the Sincerest Form of Flattery"...

[GreekGodX]

I'm pretty sure I read a while back that all his cigars are based off his favorite Cuban sizes. Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

I probably will not smoke these as I smoke almost all cc but the price doesn't seem that bad (8.50-10 bucks). Smoke what you like it doesn't matter who rolls it or where it is from.

[kuzi16]

ive met pete. i like the guy. hes a smart person who has love for nicaraguan tobacco and a love for cuban styling. im not so sure its a "rip off" as much as attempting to fit the style of cuba.
i respect what he does with tobacco. i respect his passion.
im not a fan of his cigars save for a few.

there are a ton of Tatuaje fans out there and clearly they are not on this forum, but i still fiind it a bit surprising that some here seem to have so much hate for him.
you dont like his stuff, dont buy it. plain and simple.

Originally Posted by kuzi16

ive met pete. i like the guy. hes a smart person who has love for nicaraguan tobacco and a love for cuban styling. im not so sure its a "rip off" as much as attempting to fit the style of cuba.
i respect what he does with tobacco. i respect his passion.
im not a fan of his cigars save for a few.

there are a ton of Tatuaje fans out there and clearly they are not on this forum, but i still fiind it a bit surprising that some here seem to have so much hate for him.you dont like his stuff, dont buy it. plain and simple.

No one here is showing any hate towards Pete himself. The issues are related to how the brand is marketed and packaged.

[kuzi16]

Originally Posted by ChicagoWhiteSox

No one here is showing any hate towards Pete himself. The issues are related to how the brand is marketed and packaged.

sure looks like hate to me.
i understand not liking the cigars he puts out but saying he steals everything is clearly overboard. the monster series comes to mind with little hesitation.

just about every brand ever has taken ideas from Cuban packaging. why pick on pete?

Originally Posted by kuzi16

sure looks like hate to me.
i understand not liking the cigars he puts out but saying he steals everything is clearly overboard. the monster series comes to mind with little hesitation.

just about every brand ever has taken ideas from Cuban packaging. why pick on pete?

I don't think you understand the difference between criticizing his BRAND and actually hating on HIM. There has been no one show any hate towards Pete himself at all. In fact, there has been zero hate at all. And is it fair to say the Monster Series is an outlier in the whole stolen packaging debate I'm off to smoke a FACE