In your opinion which NC is closest to a CC?

[lostark374]

Originally Posted by Stinky

A great man once said: You asked a question that really has no answer, only opinions.

Ok. . . now that you guys have beaten that dead horse into meatloaf, back to the original question:

Many times I've told people that (IMHO) the Punch Rare Corojo Double Corona (Size: 6-3/4" x 48 ring) is most like the rich flavorful Cuban cigar profile. IMHO means: In My Humble Opinion. . . so there! You asked. I gave an answer!

FWIW:
I have strong opinions about Cuban cigars in the USA. All the books and articles I've read in the last 12 years reiterate that 90 to 95 percent of Cuban cigars in the USA are counterfeit. I cannot disagree with the rock-solid authors who write these books & articles because they have unapproachable credentials in cigar manufacturing. Anyone who knows me or has been to my home, knows I have a collection of cigar books. . . and I've read every one . . . cover to cover! (I'm obsessive compulsive, but therapy ended years ago.) Anyway, I've been fortunate enough to enjoy a few Cubans myself. I can't tell you how many times someone has gifted me one of their prized Cuban cigars. . . only to smoke it and find it to be of Nicaraguan or Ecuadorian tobaccos! One (high profile) member of another cigar forum gifted me a bag full of Cubans. The first one tasted like ship! I tried another and thought the flavor-aroma was familiar. So, I shared the rest with a cigar blender/manufacture. He immediately identified the wrapper as Ecuadorian tobacco. This same scenario has played out with numerous of other "high profile" forum members who fancy themselves as "cigar aficionados" in their own minds. They spend HUGE amounts of money on cigars! (with huge humidor cabinets and/or closets full of cigars!) They think because they buy overseas, they're getting the real deal. I share these examples because many who make the effort to buy Cuban cigars just don't want to believe they are part of the 90-95% getting counterfeit cigars! They wouldn't actually recognize a Cuban cigar because they've been smoking Nicaraguan or Ecuadorian versions . . . counterfeits. But, you'll never convince them. They'll die trying to refute anyone who questions them or their sources! Gee! I hope this didn't offend anyone here! I'm still new and have spent the last decade at a number of other cigar forums. So, no offense to you all. I just don't know you well enough to insult you (yet).

I would love to challenge them (anyone) to a blind-taste-test! Different "puro" cigars from different countries. . . Nicaraguan, Honduran, Mexican, Dominican, Ecuadorian, Cuban, etc. Here's the contest: "Smoke & Tell" where the cigar (tobacco) is from! Now THIS would be MY kind of "All-Day-Herf" contest for a true Cigar Summit!

you did notice that the OP is in Canada and not in the USA and probably has access to real cubans.... not those pesky %95 fake USA sticks??


"OP" means Original Poster BTW

[cigarmonkel]

maybe the people who smoke CC's on this forum make up that 5-10%?

also you talk about the people who will argue their CC's and the fact that they are legit till death. Seems like you are doing the same thing just arguing that they are wrong. Just my

[Stinky]

Ok. You make a good point! Just sayin' . . .

[icehog3]

Gee whiz, I sure hope I am among the 5 to 10% that have a couple "real" Cubans amongst all my fakes.

I don't agree that you can't compare ccs to ncs. That it is like comparing apples and rattlesnakes. To me asking which cigars taste like ccs is like asking which apples taste like Red Delicious. All cigars are made from the same element: tobacco. So there will be some similarities in taste. Thats me

[tedrodgerscpa]

Originally Posted by Stinky

<snip>

I would love to challenge them (anyone) to a blind-taste-test! Different "puro" cigars from different countries. . . Nicaraguan, Honduran, Mexican, Dominican, Ecuadorian, Cuban, etc. Here's the contest: "Smoke & Tell" where the cigar (tobacco) is from! Now THIS would be MY kind of "All-Day-Herf" contest for a true Cigar Summit!

These are done quite regularly. Search the forums for Fredster and Moki (if it's not here, it's at Puff.com)

Someone who has a well defined palate can usually nail the difference between cuban and non-cuban with a high probability of success (usually better than the statistical probability of a coin flip)

[South Shield]

Cremosa

[Blueface]

I smoke both.
Arguments both ways can be made on this subject until one is blue in the face.
To say that 90-95% of all in the US are fakes is something I can't phantom.
In the first place, no one has ever gone through 90-95% of what I have.
That I know of, non one has gone through 90-95% of what many folks I know very well have.
As such, if one adds all those I know and adds their stock and considers no one has gone through 90-95% of what they have....................well, you don't have to be a math major to figure out where I am going here.

That 90-95% is a SPECULATION by an author. Books are written in the eyes and beliefs of the writer. I have no clue how these people can assert these facts. I have learned to believe everything I read also. I write it down and then I read it.

As to taste, there is no doubt there is a clear and distinct flavor difference between NC and CC's. After 20 years of smoking cigars and having a dad who has smoked them in Cuba, since the age of 14 (and had them all custom rolled for him) and a mother in law who rolled them and a wife's family who were Vegueros, heck if I would ever know what a real Cuban tastes like or looks like.

I'll tell you where I agree with that 90-95% statistic and that is if you buy them from the streets of Miami or if you buy them from a friend of a friend of a friend, etc. Sure, I bet 100% of those are fakes. However, to state that 90-95% of what is sold from overseas are fakes, OK, let's agree to disagree.

As cigar manufacturing has developed from Cuban seeds outside of Cuba and as makers such as Pepin have raised the bar, no doubt there are many that have some sort of similarity. Are they the same? Heck no.

BTW,
I just finished smoking a very uniquely, unlike NC tasting, H. Upmann Mag 48 EL. Best darn fake I have smoked in a while.
They are such good fakes I bought myself a second box to store for a while.

[icehog3]

Originally Posted by Blueface

That 90-95% is a SPECULATION by an author. Books are written in the eyes and beliefs of the writer. I have no clue how these people can assert these facts. I have learned to believe everything I read also. I write it down and then I read it.

But these writers have "unapproachable credentials", Carlos.

None. I have never met a NC cigar that tasted anything like a cuban.

[Blueface]

Originally Posted by icehog3

But these writers have "unapproachable credentials", Carlos.

Tom,
Let me see if I remember my learnings from "Logic" classes in school.
Here goes nothing.

My wife says I have "unapproachable credentials" when I forget to wear deodorant and do gardening.
I believe everything I read after I write it down.
Therefore, if I read something after I write it down, after doing gardening while forgetting to wear deodorant, then I too have read and written something for which I have "unapproachable credentials'.

Originally Posted by Blueface

Tom,
Let me see if I remember my learnings from "Logic" classes in school.
Here goes nothing.

My wife says I have "unapproachable credentials" when I forget to wear deodorant and do gardening.
I believe everything I read after I write it down.
Therefore, if I read something after I write it down, after doing gardening while forgetting to wear deodorant, then I too have read and written something for which I have "unapproachable credentials'.

Your conclusion"seems" valid but is not because your premises are invalid.
Therefore your argument is unsound. But it mad me smile.

[akumushi]

I seriously doubt your percentages are correct. I quote David Savona's blog on cigar aficionado when I say:
"Suckling said he vastly underestimated how many Cuban cigars
were smoked by Americans, estimating the number to be around
8 to 12 million cigars per year. Officials from Habanos S.A., Cuba's
cigar exporting organization, told him that they estimate the figure
to be 25 million or even 50 million units per year."
If your percentage was right then, that would mean Americans were consuming 500 million to 1 billion fake cigars a year. That's a lot of Cohibos.

And trust.... the far reaching "Gubmint Arm of da law" would "lub to get its paws on some o dat tax munee!"

Originally Posted by akumushi

I seriously doubt your percentages are correct. I quote David Savona's blog on cigar aficionado when I say:
"Suckling said he vastly underestimated how many Cuban cigars
were smoked by Americans, estimating the number to be around
8 to 12 million cigars per year. Officials from Habanos S.A., Cuba's
cigar exporting organization, told him that they estimate the figure
to be 25 million or even 50 million units per year."
If your percentage was right then, that would mean Americans were consuming 500 million to 1 billion fake cigars a year. That's a lot of Cohibos.

[Tripp]

Originally Posted by akumushi

I seriously doubt your percentages are correct. I quote David Savona's blog on cigar aficionado when I say:
"Suckling said he vastly underestimated how many Cuban cigars
were smoked by Americans, estimating the number to be around
8 to 12 million cigars per year. Officials from Habanos S.A., Cuba's
cigar exporting organization, told him that they estimate the figure
to be 25 million or even 50 million units per year."
If your percentage was right then, that would mean Americans were consuming 500 million to 1 billion fake cigars a year. That's a lot of Cohibos.

To me, that number does seem way out of proportion. It would make sense to me that 90% of americans who buy a handful CCs while on vacation, or from a buddy, or from the back room of their B&M are buying fakes. But I think that the amount of people who buy hundreds of boxes a year really offset those figures.

[akumushi]

Yeah, I think the 'trusted authors' confused the fact that 90% of Americans who think they have smoked a Cuban cigar have only smoked fakes. The thing is, the 10 percent that know better smoke a lot more of the genuine thing than tourists do fakes on vacation.

Originally Posted by Tripp

To me, that number does seem way out of proportion. It would make sense to me that 90% of americans who buy a handful CCs while on vacation, or from a buddy, or from the back room of their B&M are buying fakes. But I think that the amount of people who buy hundreds of boxes a year really offset those figures.

Any CCs that taste like Nicaraguan cigars? Then maybe I would smoke more CCs LOL.

[akumushi]

Originally Posted by tx_tuff

Any CCs that taste like Nicaraguan cigars? Then maybe I would smoke more CCs LOL.

I haven't tried one so I can't say they taste Nicaraguan, but it seems like the new Cohiba Behike was designed explicitly for the American market; a whole extra leaf of ligero, gigantic ring gauges and a swollen price to match. Suckling said it almost blew his head off, so it may have more of the kick you're looking for.

[wayner123]

Originally Posted by Blueface

BTW,
I just finished smoking a very uniquely, unlike NC tasting, H. Upmann Mag 48 EL. Best darn fake I have smoked in a while.
They are such good fakes I bought myself a second box to store for a while.

I find this interesting. To me the Mag 48 and Mag 50 both taste like NC's to me. More so than even a RyJ Cazadores which many believe to be the closest to NC tasting CC. I am however, in the minority most of the time in regards to taste.

[Blueface]

Originally Posted by wayner123

I find this interesting. To me the Mag 48 and Mag 50 both taste like NC's to me. More so than even a RyJ Cazadores which many believe to be the closest to NC tasting CC. I am however, in the minority most of the time in regards to taste.

Really?
Wow. Goes to show tastes vary. Everyone perceives things in a unique way.