LOST Notes

[ActionAndy]

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

Kind of reminded me of my friend's mom. She was sure creepy. Someone had to be the smoke monster to wipe out that village. It has to be mom or Jacob.

Did they ever say what the brother's name is? This episode would've been better if it was earlier in the history of the show. It seems like too much too late.

When does Ben come back to the series?

Yup. It proves that the writers did NOT have a plan all along like they kept insisting. If you look at the series as one long movie or book, there's serious pacing problems. I'd have been so much more invested in the struggles of Jacob and Black if we'd been shown this much sooner. Season one or two preferably, but hell, even earlier in Season 6.

[Brutus2600]

Originally Posted by ActionAndy

Yup. It proves that the writers did NOT have a plan all along like they kept insisting. If you look at the series as one long movie or book, there's serious pacing problems. I'd have been so much more invested in the struggles of Jacob and Black if we'd been shown this much sooner. Season one or two preferably, but hell, even earlier in Season 6.

Two things. I think that they screwed the pacing up because of ABC's refusal to allow them a hard end date to the show, thus they had no idea how long they were going to have to fill out the middle of the story.

Second, I agree I would've been more invested in the Jacob/MIB story if I had seen this episode earlier, but too much earlier and there wouldn't have really been enough understanding of what's going on. Towards the beginning of season 6 or even end of 5 would've been good, earlier than that and I think it wouldn't have made much sense and ruined the whole mystery they wanted to build up about Jacob and the MIB.

[Skywalker]

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

Kind of reminded me of my friend's mom. She was sure creepy. Someone had to be the smoke monster to wipe out that village. It has to be mom or Jacob.

Did they ever say what the brother's name is?

Much of the episode reminds me of the Biblical story of Jacob and Esau. They were twins; their father favored Esau while their mother favored Jacob. Esau is described as a hunter gather and Jacob is a trickster. Easu was to be blessed and inherit everything but was tricked by his brother, Jacob who didn't like being second choice.

[AD720]

At this point I have completely given up on trying to figure out WTF is going on and I'm just enjoying the ride.

[Mugen910]

Originally Posted by AD720

At this point I have completely given up on trying to figure out WTF is going on and I'm just enjoying the ride.

quitter!

[Superbad]

I think the whole Jacob v Smokey story line is quite pointless. I just think they ran out of ideas, and/or realized that their approach to the past few seasons really had no direction. As such they did not know to get out of the hole they dug for themselves. I will say that I am impressed at how they are able to use the same dozen filming spots over and over again, and almost make them look like different places in the jungle.

[ActionAndy]

Originally Posted by Superbad

I think the whole Jacob v Smokey story line is quite pointless. I just think they ran out of ideas, and/or realized that their approach to the past few seasons really had no direction. As such they did not know to get out of the hole they dug for themselves. I will say that I am impressed at how they are able to use the same dozen filming spots over and over again, and almost make them look like different places in the jungle.

The problem with Lost is that they couldn't actually give you clues to what's going on. If they did, people on forum sites would have been able to figure out what's going on way before the end of the series. And no one likes having their secrets come out sooner than planned.

My mom watches a ton of mystery shows and if the cable went out in the middle of a Sherlock Holmes mystery, she'd be able to tell me how it would have ended. If the Lost people actually wrote logically and with clues/rational resolutions, we would have been able to guess the ending. So they have to write like dickheads.

When MIB/Jacob's murderous stepmother said to Claudia "any answer would lead to more questions, just be thankful you're alive," she was actually speaking to us the audience. It was quite an insult. "Don't expect any good answers from us, just be thankful we're around to entertain you."

I see WHY they tooled us around but that doesn't exactly make me feel better about it.

[Brutus2600]

Originally Posted by ActionAndy

When MIB/Jacob's murderous stepmother said to Claudia "any answer would lead to more questions, just be thankful you're alive," she was actually speaking to us the audience. It was quite an insult. "Don't expect any good answers from us, just be thankful we're around to entertain you."

Haha! I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt that way about that line

[ActionAndy]

Originally Posted by Brutus2600

Haha! I'm glad I'm not the only one who felt that way about that line

I was eating dinner when the episode was on and when she said that I looked up fully expecting to see the actress delivering her line directly to the camera LOL

[Mugen910]

LOST episode #14 "Across the Sea"

1. Claudia – the real mom

a. Claudia is the female version of the name "Claudius", which is a Roman name (and judging by her clothes and speaking Latin we can assume this all occurred during the Roman Empire – early ADs).

b. Brother (nameless) saw Claudia’s ghost, but Jacob didn’t… is it because Brother doubted what Mother told him and was, therefore “open” to believe there is a world outside of the island?

2. The Game

a. The game is Senet, and comes from ancient Egypt, maybe as far back as 3000 BC, and was often buried in tombs with the dead as its luck element was believed to demonstrate that certain people were protected by the gods. The game board that Brother finds could signal that the Egyptians came to the island well before Claudia's people, or that a group of Egyptians crashed there during the twins' childhood.

b. Brother says “one day you can make up your own game and everyone else will have to follow your rules." So, I’ll assume that means the island’s protector makes up the rules. Was one of Jacob’s rules (after Brother becomes Smokey) “you can scan people who come to the island to see if they are pure/ good or jaded/ corrupted. If someone scans “good” then leave them alone. Give them a chance to make the right choices. If someone scans “corrupted” you can kill them instantly.” Just a thought.

3. Mother

a. What she created for the boys reminded me of the Truman Show (Jim Carrey movie). She could tell the kids whatever she wanted and they wouldn’t know the difference… until a group of outsiders came to the island. Considering all the things she told them what was true and what was a lie told to keep them there?

b. Did Mother’s killing of Claudia create a curse of the pregnant women? Did Brother reinforce that curse by killing his adoptive Mother? Ethan Rom and Aaron Littleton were born on the island — but maybe they were exceptions permitted by Jacob or to facilitate their respective plans for the Losties…their “loopholes.”

c. ''I've made it so you can never hurt each other.'' Besides explaining why Brother had to use a proxy to kill Jacob, Mother's line said something about the power that an Island guardian wields — including the ability to make ''the rules.''

d. When Mother returned to her home/ cave after filling in the wheel well, she silently surveyed the scene and found the Senet box. Then Brother stabbed her. She fell to the ground and whispered a word: ''Nothing.'' She told her son that she couldn't let him leave because she loved him, and then she thanked him for killing her and died.

i. Three things to notice about this scene:

1. How she ''silently'' surveyed her camp. Remember Dogen's instructions to Sayid? Sayid had to plunge the knife into Flocke’s chest before Flocke spoke. Also, Smokey instructed Richard similarly when he sent Richard to kill Jacob (kill him before he speaks to you). Mother didn’t speak so Brother could kill her… she wanted to die.

2. Mother said ''Nothing'' before she died. Sayid also seemed to suffer from some kind of numbness, a state of emotional nothingness. Said he felt numb/ nothing.

3. Brother used the same knife to kill Mother that Dogen gave Sayid to kill Flocke, that Smokey gave Richard to kill Jacob.

4. Jungle Boy

a. It’s young Jacob. It seems that Jacob is appearing as his own younger form in an attempt to rattle Smokey/ Brother.

b. Both in their youth and as adults, Jacob pummeled Brother bloody. I'm guessing that explains the blood on young, ghost Jacob's hands when he appeared to Flocke in “The Substitute.”

5. Tapestry

a. Mother was weaving a tapestry, recalling the scene last year where we were introduced to Jacob weaving in the base of the statue.

b. When Mother returned to the caves after filling in Brother’s wheel well, she found her tapestry destroyed…Flocke destroyed Jacob’s tapestry in the foot of the statue earlier this season.

6. The Cave of Light

a. From what I’ve read, best described as a “whirlpool of ethereal life-giving energy — a wellspring of eternal life.”

b. Mother said some interesting things… "if the light goes out here, it goes out everywhere" (this is what Widmore and Ms. Hawking are referring to when they say that if Smokey gets off the island everything else will cease to exist. Mother also said that going down there is a fate "much worse than dying"… does she know this because it happened to her? Is she some sort of Smoke Monster? Is that how she killed all of the Roman settlers, burned their camp, and filled in the wheel well?

c. Silly theory… Is the cave light “time” (or eternal life)? Mother said “every man has a little… but wants more…” Was she Mother Time? Is the Smoke Monster the end of time (which is why everything ceases to exist if he’s released)?

i. “They’re not like us. They don’t belong here. We are here for a reason” the boys were told. And when the boys asked what the reason was, after a long pause, Mother responded “It’s not time yet.”

ii. Faraday said “I can make time,” Room 23 brainwashed with “only fools are enslaved by time and space”, the list goes on!

d. Brother looked at the cave light and declared 'It's beautiful.” Exactly John Locke's statement upon looking into "the Smoke Monster" the first time. Now that we know what the Smoke Monster was borne out of, it makes sense. Was Smokey showing this “beautiful” image to Locke enticing him to have a communion with the island, knowing that Locke was the one Smokey would impersonate/ become one day?

e. Consider the Sideways world, and remember that The Island is sunken there. Did someone succeed in putting out the light in that world? And what does it mean that the Losties are now remembering their Island world experience?

7. Mother Loved the Boys Differently

a. She knew that Jacob was trustworthy and loyal, whereas Brother was not. Therefore, she had to do a little extra with Brother, small things like leaving a box for him on the beach... Jacob thought she loved Brother more, but she was actually grooming Brother to be her replacement. She didn’t realize until the end that Jacob was truly the one.

b. When Mother told Jacob he would replace her as island protector she said "You don't really have a choice." I think that is the key moment that led to Jacob's methods...that there is always a choice/ free will.

c. Jacob was hurt that Mother had obviously wanted Brother to be the protector, initially. However, the candidate you get isn't always the one who looked best on paper, as Jacob discovers later with our Losties. Think about John Locke, whose faith, love for the island and jungle survival skills seemed like he would make the perfect person to become the next protector…. But it was Jack all along (or at least, after much pondering while looking out at the ocean, it became Jack).

8. The Island’s Light/ Power/ Energy Source

a. Brother creates/ designs the frozen, time-traveling wheel mechanism, but never finishes it. Who does? The Dharma Initiative?

9. Brother

a. A sympathetic character… he just wanted to see what else was out there…the opposite of the emotionless monster we've come to see him as in the current Island timeline. This is what centuries of resentment will do to you!

b. Adam and Eve skeletons… Brother and Mother. L

c. Jacob didn’t kill him (just like Mother said they couldn’t hurt each other)… Jacob beat him up, knocked him out, and sent him down the river into the cave of light. There (although this is up for debate) his soul turned into Smokey, his body was discarded. Smokey is his soul, that’s why it still looks like Brother, but we also see his corpse… this is why he previously said “Jacob stole my body, my humanity.” Even as John Locke he speaks from Brother’s point of view .

10. Taking Babies

a. Maybe when Jacob starts his group of Others he gives them orders to take the babies and “good ones” (like Cindy the flight attendant) because he wants them to be protected from the outside world’s greed/ corruption. He didn’t want anyone else to become jaded, like his brother.

11. Desmond

a. This episode may have shed some light on why Desmond is so important. The glowing light and the pockets of electromagnetic energy are one in the same. Desmond may be the only person who can enter the cave of light without becoming a Smoke Monster.

12. Interview with one of the show’s producers: An interesting question and answer…

Q: When Mother slaughters the people in the human village, the iconography looked very much like the Dharma bunkers after the purge. Was this your way of suggesting why it was Jacob might have allowed The Others to slaughter the Dharma folk - that this is the punishment for anyone who gets too close to unlocking the island's secrets?

A: Damon Lindelof (producer/ writer): “In terms of what Jacob allowed, what he didn't allow, what The Others did of their own volition, with Ben basically saying "This came down from Jacob" is all in the area that is subject to interpretation purposely. What our intention was is that there is a repeating vicious cycle that seems to happen on this island, where people come to the island, they try to figure out what makes the island work, and the closer they came leads them to their own inevitable demise.”

13. Was the Others’ Temple built over the cave of light? Supporting evidence:

a. The temple is hidden in the jungle and hard to find (like the cave) and the others and Dogen are EXTREMELY PROTECTIVE of it.

b. The temple has a hot tub that brings people back to life, or heals mortal wounds at the very least,

c. Smokie lived under the Temple (was released when Ben pulled a water drain plug).

d. Check out this video of the Losties arriving at the temple. Those super straight trees look very similar to the ones on the path to the light cave. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oeumU...eature=related

[JE3146]

Who makes these compilations of ideas... and are they going to make a book when this is over?

Cus I want to read it... before I rewatch the entire series..... in August

[OLS]

This makes me wonder if anyone will want to watch it over. The producers say that they are
gonna answer all the questions, then they admit that they aren't even gonna scratch the
surface of the answers. People have invested so much time in this thinking it made sense
somehow, and that at the ned they would find out what the hell was actually going on.
But once the last episode has aired and it's just the DVD sales that keep this giant boner
alive in culture, They will find out why you do it right and make people satisfied, fulfilled
and cathartically spent. Who would want a DVD set of how this farce has turned out?
"I wasted 100 hours of my life and all I have to show is this Lost Tshirt."

[Mugen910]

Originally Posted by JE3146

Who makes these compilations of ideas... and are they going to make a book when this is over?

Cus I want to read it... before I rewatch the entire series..... in August

A friend of mine does a lot of data mining in various forums to compile this list for us Lost fans. It's not all her theories so I doubt she'll be making a book

[JE3146]

Originally Posted by OLS

This makes me wonder if anyone will want to watch it over. The producers say that they are
gonna answer all the questions, then they admit that they aren't even gonna scratch the
surface of the answers. People have invested so much time in this thinking it made sense
somehow, and that at the ned they would find out what the hell was actually going on.
But once the last episode has aired and it's just the DVD sales that keep this giant boner
alive in culture, They will find out why you do it right and make people satisfied, fulfilled
and cathartically spent. Who would want a DVD set of how this farce has turned out?
"I wasted 100 hours of my life and all I have to show is this Lost Tshirt."

You can rest assured knowing I won't spend a cent on the DVD box set compiling all 6 seasons....








I'll be buying the blu-ray set instead ...

[kaisersozei]

I guess I'm one of the poor saps who is looking forward to Season 6 on DVD. We already have 1, 2, 4 & 5. I think the series is moving toward a decent conclusion, with enough questions being answered to satisfy me. They're not spoon-fed answers, but I can honestly say that I get what this story has been about.

I have heard that the producers/writers are re-working key episodes and story elements from all six seasons to make the story more cohesive and answer further questions that they original pass through couldn't handle.

Rumours have it that the extra/reworked footage will add up to an average of about 5 minutes per episode, or about 10 hours total never-before-seen footage in the whole 6 season box set.

Sorry if my last comment got people overly excited. In the end, I just made that up.

[JE3146]

Originally Posted by Cyanide

Sorry if my last comment got people overly excited. In the end, I just made that up.

There's a special place in hell for people like you....

[Mugen910]

This weekend’s schedule:

1. Saturday 8pm ABC will re-air the pilot episode
2. Sunday 7pm ABC airs a 2-hour recap/ retrospective. 9pm ABC airs the finale episode “The End.” It’s 2.5 hours long, followed by a Jimmy Kimmel: Aloha to Lost show, after the news.
3. Monday start watching the show all over again.

[JE3146]

Originally Posted by Mugen910

This weekend’s schedule:

1. Saturday 8pm ABC will re-air the pilot episode
2. Sunday 7pm ABC airs a 2-hour recap/ retrospective. 9pm ABC airs the finale episode “The End.” It’s 2.5 hours long, followed by a Jimmy Kimmel: Aloha to Lost show, after the news.
3. Monday start watching the show all over again.

Anyone else just a tad bit nervous?