Paul Garmirian talks trash about younger cigar makers

[T.G]

Sounds like the ranting throws of a jealous, bitter, little man who never achieved the success he somehow feels he is owed meanwhile he is envious of those around him who are newer to the industry yet far more successful that he ever was.

Funny, you talk to any of the guys he singled out, pretty much all they have to say about other people in the industry is complimentary. All this ass has to say is how great he is and how bad/clueless/worthless everyone else is.

What a piece of work.

[mosesbotbol]

I actually enjoyed the article and respect his perspective. He makes cigars that appeal to a different cigar smoker and my hunch is many reacting to the article weren’t smoking cigars back then. A lot has changed in the cigar industry, and not all for the good. I don’t think its envy; he could’ve sold out long ago. He has his “shtick” and they have theirs.

It’s got to be about 20 years since I have had a PG cigar, but I consider then a premium long term brand like Davidoff, Dunhill, and for better or worse Oscar. How many under 50’s are smoking Tempe Hall? The same ones smoking PG’s.

The article stated, “I associate cigars within my frame of reference,” he said, “with what they ought to be. And I fancy everybody has a role model. I fancy myself as a cigar merchant in the latter part of the 19th century in London: You have quality products and you don’t go nuts.”

That really sums it up. If you like that kind of aesthetic theme to cigar smoking, you are on the kind of smoker who may fancy a PG.

[poriggity]

PG does sound like a jerk.. But I'm with Peter on this one. I am a blogger, but I don't go around to all the sites pushing links to my site... I do reviews, post them here, with a link to my site in my signature. If someone wants to check it out, that's cool, if not, no skin off my back.

[pnoon]

Originally Posted by poriggity

PG does sound like a jerk.. But I'm with Peter on this one. I am a blogger, but I don't go around to all the sites pushing links to my site... I do reviews, post them here, with a link to my site in my signature. If someone wants to check it out, that's cool, if not, no skin off my back.

Exactly how it should be, Scott. Kudos to you.

My point here is not about PG and his opinions of the newer guys. What ticks me off is members who join forums for the sole purpose of linking to their blog in order to validate their purpose. As if their opinion is more informed or relevant than the opinions and perspectives of the members of our community.

[cjhalbrooks]

Well i have only two things to say.
1- This was the first blog i have ever read.
2. I will make it a point to try his cigars (at least one) and then i will make my opinion on PG. Just like every cigar i have smoked to this day.

[omowasu]

Originally Posted by pnoon

Exactly how it should be, Scott. Kudos to you.

My point here is not about PG and his opinions of the newer guys. What ticks me off is members who join forums for the sole purpose of linking to their blog in order to validate their purpose. As if their opinion is more informed or relevant than the opinions and perspectives of the members of our community.

Exactly, especially given the way it was posted with a link followed by the most incendiary paragraph in the article.

I wonder if the same link and paragraph were posted on other forums. Im sure some of the folks here would know if they are on the other sites. This is the only site I frequent...

As for Garmirian, what he stated could be taken in several contexts. He doesn't make a bad cigar, but my tastes have moved toward stronger smokes where Tatuaje and Illusione are a great fit (as are several others).

[icehog3]

I haven't seen it on the other sites I peruse, Scott.

[poriggity]

Originally Posted by icehog3

I haven't seen it on the other sites I peruse, Scott.

I've seen it on at least one other forum that I know of, coincidentally, this guy also has 3 posts there, and registered this month. People that register on forums just for the sole purpose of pushing their blog/publication to the masses, are exactly the kind of people that give the rest of us bloggers, who do it for fun and being informative, a bad name. Just my opinion.
Scott

[icehog3]

Be interesting to see if David reads the comments on the threads he starts, or simply moves on. I'd like to hear his thoughts on how this type of "blog redirect" is viewed by the true members of this community.

[RevSmoke]

Wow, that does appear a bit harsh. I will say however that I have never had a bad PG. in fact, on of my favorite sticks is his regular line Bombones. Don't have many of them, but enjoy them immensely when I can find them.

[RevSmoke]

By the way Tom, I think you'd really like PGs. I think you'd be impressed with the flavor profile.

[pnoon]

Originally Posted by icehog3

Be interesting to see if David reads the comments on the threads he starts, or simply moves on. I'd like to hear his thoughts on how this type of "blog redirect" is viewed by the true members of this community.

At this point, he has not read anything on CA beyond his own posts.

[shilala]

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

I actually enjoyed the article and respect his perspective. He makes cigars that appeal to a different cigar smoker and my hunch is many reacting to the article weren’t smoking cigars back then. A lot has changed in the cigar industry, and not all for the good. I don’t think its envy; he could’ve sold out long ago. He has his “shtick” and they have theirs.

It’s got to be about 20 years since I have had a PG cigar, but I consider then a premium long term brand like Davidoff, Dunhill, and for better or worse Oscar. How many under 50’s are smoking Tempe Hall? The same ones smoking PG’s.

The article stated, “I associate cigars within my frame of reference,” he said, “with what they ought to be. And I fancy everybody has a role model. I fancy myself as a cigar merchant in the latter part of the 19th century in London: You have quality products and you don’t go nuts.”
That really sums it up. If you like that kind of aesthetic theme to cigar smoking, you are on the kind of smoker who may fancy a PG.

I respectfully disagree, Moses.
I'd submit that if you appreciate that sort of aesthetic theme to cigar smoking, you are the kind of smoker who may fancy a cigar. Period.
Just because this gentleman expresses this odd projection into his brand doesn't remotely mean that anyone picks up on it, or wishes to wear a wig, monocle and bloomers while they smoke.
Certainly no more than one should want to get a tattoo were they to smoke a Tatuaje.
If a brand of cigar defines an individual, the first thing I'd think is that they very much undervalue themselves as a human being.
Maybe even so much so that they need to tear down others to prop themselves up, as Paul has exhibited in this case.

[lenguamor]

The grumpy old man in me gets what he's saying, although I don't agree. Not with his characterization of younger cigar makers.

I've been smoking for almost 40 years. From my first cigar—handmade, luckily—I knew exactly what I wanted from a cigar.

I get impatient with young smokers; it does frustrate me sometimes that I have an encyclopedia of knowledge about smoking and keeping cigars, but they don't ask! Or they ask all the wrong questions (IMO).

And if you'd asked me 10 years ago about Drew Estates and some of the others that Garmirian refers to, I might've held a similar opinion to the old man's. Because I was coming at it from a firmly, sadly uninformed viewpoint.

And, truth be told, some of the marketing does put me off, and some of it makes me determined not to try their cigars. For instance, JdN's advertising 100% turns me off; I never wanted to be the Marlborough man nor in a motorcycle gang, and less so now, in my mid-fifties. And some brands' use of ersatz military imagery and accoutrements downright pisses me off.

But what puzzles me about PG's vitriol is that he's met these guys, and presumably he's tried their products. Not all of their cigars are great, and I'd even venture to say that a lot of them are not very good at all; but some of them are superlative, and a select few are among the jewels of modern offerings.

The fact that he's met J. Drew and isn't totally infected by his enthusiasm, his drive and the joy and pride he puts into his cigars, not to mention the undeniable quality and flavor of lines like LP, tells me that the old man has succumbed to no small amount of bitterness.

And that's a shame.

[Jefft72]

I found it interesting to see that Dion remarked via Twitter about this story.

Dion Giolito ‏@illusionecigars
"Dr. Garmirian really is a great guy. A bit eccentric, ind I can identify for sure -"
"It sucks that Paul Garmirian said the things he said in his interview. I've always looked up to him - even paid Homage to him in my ~68~."

[JPjr]

Originally Posted by lenguamor

And if you'd asked me 10 years ago about Drew Estates and some of the others that Garmirian refers to, I might've held a similar opinion to the old man's. Because I was coming at it from a firmly, sadly uninformed viewpoint.

And, truth be told, some of the marketing does put me off, and some of it makes me determined not to try their cigars. For instance, JdN's advertising 100% turns me off; I never wanted to be the Marlborough man nor in a motorcycle gang, and less so now, in my mid-fifties. And some brands' use of ersatz military imagery and accoutrements downright pisses me off.

But what puzzles me about PG's vitriol is that he's met these guys, and presumably he's tried their products. Not all of their cigars are great, and I'd even venture to say that a lot of them are not very good at all; but some of them are superlative, and a select few are among the jewels of modern offerings.

The fact that he's met J. Drew and isn't totally infected by his enthusiasm, his drive and the joy and pride he puts into his cigars, not to mention the undeniable quality and flavor of lines like LP, tells me that the old man has succumbed to no small amount of bitterness.

And that's a shame.

BRILLIANT post. I don't recall that I've tried anything from PG, and the "live and let live" in me says everyone is entitled to their own opinion - and tht wouldn't sway me from trying in the future. But I agree, the passion these guys put into their smokes and their businesses can hardly be bad at all. Maybe "not elegantly stated" could be the phrase of the day...

[Whipper Snapper]

Always liked the PG's I've had. Not quite sure what to make of this.

[RevSmoke]

Originally Posted by lenguamor

The grumpy old man in me gets what he's saying, although I don't agree. Not with his characterization of younger cigar makers.

I've been smoking for almost 40 years. From my first cigar—handmade, luckily—I knew exactly what I wanted from a cigar.

I get impatient with young smokers; it does frustrate me sometimes that I have an encyclopedia of knowledge about smoking and keeping cigars, but they don't ask! Or they ask all the wrong questions (IMO).

And if you'd asked me 10 years ago about Drew Estates and some of the others that Garmirian refers to, I might've held a similar opinion to the old man's. Because I was coming at it from a firmly, sadly uninformed viewpoint.

And, truth be told, some of the marketing does put me off, and some of it makes me determined not to try their cigars. For instance, JdN's advertising 100% turns me off; I never wanted to be the Marlborough man nor in a motorcycle gang, and less so now, in my mid-fifties. And some brands' use of ersatz military imagery and accoutrements downright pisses me off.

But what puzzles me about PG's vitriol is that he's met these guys, and presumably he's tried their products. Not all of their cigars are great, and I'd even venture to say that a lot of them are not very good at all; but some of them are superlative, and a select few are among the jewels of modern offerings.

The fact that he's met J. Drew and isn't totally infected by his enthusiasm, his drive and the joy and pride he puts into his cigars, not to mention the undeniable quality and flavor of lines like LP, tells me that the old man has succumbed to no small amount of bitterness.

And that's a shame.

Amen.

Yes, the lack of respect that he idicated toward these guys trying to make a go in the industry is disappointing.

Different tastes in cigars is what draws me to them, and in regard to cigars, variety is the spice of life.

Peace of the Lord be with you.

[Subvet642]

Originally Posted by Bill86

The "looney club"? Boy he is a silly goose.

I'll take the Looney Club all day long; hell, we are in an asylum, after all!

[T.G]

Originally Posted by Subvet642

I'll take the Looney Club all day long; hell, we are in an asylum, after all!

Better than the Culture Club, because they just come and go, they come and go....