Bcs - wtf 2011

[E.J.]

Originally Posted by OLS

Oh God I hope I never give anyone the impression that I think the SEC is top to bottom better than
the rest, goodness, far from it. Out of the 12 member schools, I would think that over half of them
failed to perform anywhere near "standards" and way below all of their fan's expectations. Oddly enough,
Vanderbilt fans got a chance to see their team play extremely well for most of the year, but still had
to live with a dismal record. This year was an embarassment for a LOT of SEC schools. Back when
I used to argue with the Florida fans here, they used to tell me, "We just reload, babay..."
Not this year, apparently, lol. When I talk about these teams, bama and LSU, I am talking about those
teams and no one else. The rest are quite beatable....the top 2, I am not sure they can be beaten.

#2 lost, thus I am 100% confident they can be beaten....in fact, they have been....

[E.J.]

Originally Posted by OLS

On another topic brought up, I don't think we can discount a playoff as being just MORE MONEY thrown at the problem.
In my opinion, YES it is significantly more money on the pile, but the RESULT of the money is better in the end,
or viewed by more people as fair.

And E.J., I really hate that there can't be the bama-Stanford and LSU-OK State games on tap to show you how
incorrect I think you are on this 1&2 deal. I AM BIASED, but I think LSU and bama could take any and all comers
and walk away double digit winners. I guess we just lost our best chance to see if I am right, but YES, there are
a lot of great teams out there, I just don't think people fully comprehend the juggernaut that these two teams
really represent in full contact glory. There are great teams in football, but somehow they come down to the
bowl games and their awesome attacks just don't hold up for 60 minutes. I don't want this being a SEC against
the world thread, I started it specifically to get away from the chirping about that stuff, but there DOES exist
an element of that in my argument, I guess. I have watched all the "good games" over the past decade, and
I see the fans go nuts when Ohio State rips off a 80 yard touchdown pass, but in the 4th quarter it's always
glum looks and disbelief. NOT A SEC discussion, except that the teams I argue about in 2011 are in the SEC west.

Stanford is out, at least out with that scenario... Again, I don't think you get a shot at a national title if you cannot win your own conference(Oregon won the PAC12).
Right now we have a playoff system....or at least are told we do....and that is the regular season.

If they want to go a 16 team playoff and bring in at large teams, great.... But if it is 4 teams, IMO...those 4 teams better have won their conference... I could not care less if they had to go through a team that many consider the best in the Country... If you want to be the best in the country, beat that team when given the opportunity, if you can't, someone else should get a try.

[OLS]

You want to know irony?? You well know I think LSU is better than bama. But I KNOW LSU can be beaten.
We are not disciplined enough on offense and we don't have a good enough passer in J. Jefferson to win every
time out. I don't think bama can be beaten. They are going to make some QB mistakes, and their kicking game is
a joke in 2011. But on balance, they are still gonna get ya. We escaped with a win in Tuscaloosa, and we will
likely do so again in New Orleans. But not because we are gonna score on bama through the run or the pass.
We are going to punch em in the mouth SO HARD that they are gonna make some mistakes, and we are going
to capitalize in points or field position. We are going to FORCE errors by their passers and runners and get a quick
defensive score. We are going to kick them into their own end and our D is gonna try to keep em there. We are
going to make field goals. But as good as I think we are, we are not going to do anything but escape with
a win, because they are just TOO TOUGH. And if we can't do it easily, I don't think anyone else even has a chance.

[OLS]

Originally Posted by E.J.

I know that on November 5th 2011, LSU went into Alabama's house and came out with a victory. Do you think the better team didn't win that game? The scoreboard was wrong?

I have argued this til they are blue in the face from ignoring me, lol.

[OLS]

Originally Posted by E.J.

Stanford is out, at least out with that scenario... .

This is why I was asking you in the SEC thread to pick a dog in the hunt.
I know little or nothing about who I would pit against bama and LSU in separate
big-time BCS games. I am too focused on the god-like wonder of the LSU Tigers
to know who they would play if this were being done right. I need outside
perspectives to TELL me what they think would be proper.

Let's all play a game. BCS has set this up to be a tourney. Fill in
these brackets:

LSU versus

Bama versus

[E.J.]

I witnessed first hand the greatness of an Alabama team that was going to mop the floor with the University of Utah in a bowl game. They had weeks to prepare and I heard it for weeks and weeks about how Utah couldn't play with a team built like that Alabama team.

Hell, I heard it from fans, from professionals on television, from everyone that had sound coming out of their mouth....but that is why you play the games. Didn't quite turn out how everyone thought.... I watched that game, have watched it a few times.....there was one team that was far more physical on the field, one team that dominated play, one defense that looked faster, stronger, better.....thing is, it wasn't the one everyone said it was going to be. It wasn't done with smoke and mirrors, but with blood and sweat...

Nothing can be said that is going to change my mind on two things, that in my mind, should keep Alabama out of the BCS Championship game. 1 - Alabama didn't win their conference 2 - Alabama already played LSU and lost


I cannot express enough that YES, ALABAMA IS A GREAT TEAM! I will scream it from the rooftops....but they didn't win their conference and they already lost this game, on their home turf, a month ago.

[OLS]

Ah, it's the old OLS treatment.....You simply do not believe they deserve to BE THERE in the first place.
Again, just in a different thread, I agree with you there. But I guess we are not going to be able to pin you
down on two best teams in major college football, huh? And I watched that game, too where the Utes hung
with bama, but I think this is a better team......still, point taken.

[E.J.]

Originally Posted by OLS

This is why I was asking you in the SEC thread to pick a dog in the hunt.
I know little or nothing about who I would pit against bama and LSU in separate
big-time BCS games. I am too focused on the god-like wonder of the LSU Tigers
to know who they would play if this were being done right. I need outside
perspectives to TELL me what they think would be proper.

Let's all play a game. BCS has set this up to be a tourney. Fill in
these brackets:

LSU versus

Bama versus

See, I wouldn't have Bama in a 4 team tourney, unless you had all the conference champions in already...then you could talk about teams like Stanford, Alabama, Virginia Tech, at large teams that couldn't win their own conference.

LSU vs Okie Lite and then everything else. Two best conferences this year, two conference champions. It is not like OSU is the winner of the Big East or has 2 losses. They are not exactly backdooring their way into this game...

[E.J.]

Originally Posted by ols

and i watched that game, too where the utes dominated bama, but i think this is a better team......still, point taken.

fify

[357]

Originally Posted by E.J.

I witnessed first hand the greatness of an Alabama team that was going to mop the floor with the University of Utah in a bowl game. They had weeks to prepare and I heard it for weeks and weeks about how Utah couldn't play with a team built like that Alabama team.

Hell, I heard it from fans, from professionals on television, from everyone that had sound coming out of their mouth....but that is why you play the games. Didn't quite turn out how everyone thought.... I watched that game, have watched it a few times.....there was one team that was far more physical on the field, one team that dominated play, one defense that looked faster, stronger, better.....thing is, it wasn't the one everyone said it was going to be. It wasn't done with smoke and mirrors, but with blood and sweat...

Nothing can be said that is going to change my mind on two things, that in my mind, should keep Alabama out of the BCS Championship game. 1 - Alabama didn't win their conference 2 - Alabama already played LSU and lost


I cannot express enough that YES, ALABAMA IS A GREAT TEAM! I will scream it from the rooftops....but they didn't win their conference and they already lost this game, on their home turf, a month ago.

Who thought Boise State would beat Oklahoma in the 2007 Fiesta Bowl; on a Statue of Liberty play of all things?

Yet it happened. You can't justify giving one team two shots to beat the #1 team and 4 other one loss teams 0 chances.

[E.J.]

Originally Posted by 357

Who thought Boise State would beat Oklahoma in the 2007 Fiesta Bowl; on a Statue of Liberty play of all things?

Yet it happened. You can't justify giving one team two shots to beat the #1 team and 4 other one loss teams 0 chances.

I agree.....it is what I said...

[OLS]

I like the atmosphere in this thread. I can't say these kinds of things anywhere else.
There I don't know what I am talking about, here, I am in the majority, lol.

[OLS]

Originally Posted by E.J.

fify

I couldn't recall who actually won, so I put "hung with", lol.

[OLS]

Originally Posted by E.J.

See, I wouldn't have Bama in a 4 team tourney.

Neither would I, top 2 anyway, in fact I think it is an insult to LSU to throw bama in there as if they
deserved it. I think that they are a giant among teams, but it's like you said elsewhere, this was not
a foregone conclusion when the pre-season polls came out or anything, everyone had their chances
to take care of business. That's why I was thinking Houston deserved a shot like anyone else until the
past weekend. I understand why the pollsters did what they did, but that's not saying it was fair.
And I don't mean fair from the LSU perspective, hell no, bring em on, we can beat em twice. But
it's the obverse...say they win, after doing nothing but doing their nails for 6 weeks. That would be
a travesty. But a NC all the same.

[rizzle]

Originally Posted by E.J.

I know that on November 5th 2011, LSU went into Alabama's house and came out with a victory. Do you think the better team didn't win that game? The scoreboard was wrong?

Yes, apparently be a great team, in a great conference and "just win" against a bunch of .500/sub .500 teams....

That's not what I asked you. And I do happen to still believe we are the better team, but that's a different argument all together.

And I acknowledged our loss. Had we have won that game, you're still probably looking at an Alabama - LSU championship game. Why? Because everybody else that had a clear path failed. All OK St had to do was beat a lowly 6-6 team and they were in. Done deal. Stanford got beat by Oregon who then proceeded to get beat by USC.

So again, who do you think is better than LSU and Bama?

[rizzle]

Originally Posted by OLS

I have argued this til they are blue in the face from ignoring me, lol.

Your being far from truthful. But don't grafitti up this thread, too. If you've got a problem with it and want to discuss it, I'm way more than willing to take it to PM, since you seem to have a huge freaking problem with it.

[rizzle]

Originally Posted by E.J.

I witnessed first hand the greatness of an Alabama team that was going to mop the floor with the University of Utah in a bowl game. They had weeks to prepare and I heard it for weeks and weeks about how Utah couldn't play with a team built like that Alabama team.

Hell, I heard it from fans, from professionals on television, from everyone that had sound coming out of their mouth....but that is why you play the games. Didn't quite turn out how everyone thought.... I watched that game, have watched it a few times.....there was one team that was far more physical on the field, one team that dominated play, one defense that looked faster, stronger, better.....thing is, it wasn't the one everyone said it was going to be. It wasn't done with smoke and mirrors, but with blood and sweat...

Nothing can be said that is going to change my mind on two things, that in my mind, should keep Alabama out of the BCS Championship game. 1 - Alabama didn't win their conference 2 - Alabama already played LSU and lost


I cannot express enough that YES, ALABAMA IS A GREAT TEAM! I will scream it from the rooftops....but they didn't win their conference and they already lost this game, on their home turf, a month ago.

So now your whole argument comes to light. You're a Utah fan.

Yes, you guys wiped the grass with us. We weren't ready, lost our 3 year starting left tackle the night before the game for illegal agent contact, came out flat and unmotivated, and got waxed. And then forgot about it. Well, not really forgot about it, but you get the point. You know the funny thing about this whole discussion? Were it not for the BCS, Utah would have never sniffed that BCS bowl game. But again, different argument.

[357]

Originally Posted by E.J.

I agree.....it is what I said...

Sorry, I was agreeing with you. I just forgot to include that part.

Originally Posted by rizzle

So again, who do you think is better than LSU and Bama?

I would argue Oklahoma State is better than Alabama. You can argue the strength of the teams that beat them, but the fact is we KNOW LSU is better than Alabama. We don't know if LSU is better than OK State; and that's the point.

We'll never know thanks to the BCS.

Think about this from the other side. If Alabama won, would you think it fair that LSU would get to play them again? Why should you have to beat one team twice and the winner of the SECOND game is the only one that counts?

[rizzle]

Originally Posted by 357

Sorry, I was agreeing with you. I just forgot to include that part.




I would argue Oklahoma State is better than Alabama. You can argue the strength of the teams that beat them, but the fact is we KNOW LSU is better than Alabama. We don't know if LSU is better than OK State; and that's the point.

We'll never know thanks to the BCS.

Think about this from the other side. If Alabama won, would you think it fair that LSU would get to play them again? Why should you have to beat one team twice and the winner of the SECOND game is the only one that counts?

The thing is, it isn't about fair. It's about matching 1 vs 2. In some people's minds, since we lost to the best, are not the best, it is impossible to be considered the second best.

Take it a step further. Bama lost by three to the best team in the country, who lost no other games. Ok State lost by three to a 6-6 Iowa State team that lost to 6 other teams by an average of 20+ points a game. If we had lost to Mississppi State instead of LSU, do you think we should be considered?

Look, I'm not a huge BCS fan, please don't mistake it. It's simply a fluke that the two best teams this year reside in the same division. Probably will never happen again. But I think a lot of the arguments out there are simply due to SEC fatigue. And that's understandable. But it is what it is.

[ninjavanish]

There is obviously only one way to settle this:

MORTAL KOMBAT!!!

<queue techno music>