Most complex and dynamic regular production smoke

[weak_link]

Originally Posted by RevSmoke

Coronados seem to fit this bill.

I'm not familiar with the Coronados, fantastic!

edit** just looked this one up, I see it's a LFD. The chisel is one of the only cigars to sit my butt back down and then turn me green. Is the Coranados in the same league in terms of Vita N?

[Ismith75]

Try the corona or the churchill. The churchill is unreal.

[ninjavanish]

Originally Posted by ninjavanish

I honestly feel like you guys are overlooking some of the standard cigars...

Obviously Cremosa is the most complex cigar of all.

Ok fine.

So you don't like cremosas.

But in all seriousness... I don't think you need vary off into Liga Privada land or into the realm of tatauje or illusione or any real boutique cigars to find what you're looking for.

Believe me when i say I don't have anything against tatuaje or illusione but i feel like if you're looking for something with complexity then you need look no further than a fuente chateau queen b... Or a sun grown double chateau

Or perhaps maybe something as simple as a nc fonseca 5-5 maduro.

There are tons and tons of cigars out there that offer complexity. I feel like people get a little too enamored with the tatuaje and illusione and the marketing whizzes that they forget about some of the cigars that have been around... Possibly in semi-obscurity, for years and years.

For instance... I don't think you even need to mention the name tatuaje or even the thought of a cc (as it seems some have) to agree that the world of nc's offers a vastly wider variety of blends, bodies, flavor, complexity, and uniqueness.

Ive got nothing against cc's but i cant help but feel like they have been so far surpassed in quality and variety by nc's since the cigar boom that the only real appeal they have is merely their unique puro identity of isom tobacco.

I don't know really, obviously everyones tastes are different but I feel like the replies in this thread have been so repetitive that someone ought to say

"branch out! Find a complex cigar that YOU like... For yourself! The journey to that discovery will be as intriguing as the discovery itself!"

Not at all trying to be inflammatory to any of the botls who previously posted... Whose opinions i respect greatly... Simply trying to offer some different points of view.

[icehog3]

Originally Posted by ninjavanish

Ive got nothing against cc's but i cant help but feel like they have been so far surpassed in quality and variety by nc's since the cigar boom that the only real appeal they have is merely their unique puro identity of isom tobacco.

Opinions may vary.

Try lots of cigars, then smoke what you like, like what you smoke.

[Emjaysmash]

Originally Posted by weak_link

I'm not familiar with the Coronados, fantastic!

edit** just looked this one up, I see it's a LFD. The chisel is one of the only cigars to sit my butt back down and then turn me green. Is the Coranados in the same league in terms of Vita N?

No, these aren't as full of Vitamin N. also, they're a lot better then the LFDs IMHO.

[Ismith75]

Originally Posted by Emjaysmash

No, these aren't as full of Vitamin N. also, they're a lot better then the LFDs IMHO.

My thoughts exactly. You wouldn't know it's something from LG without the name. Full bodied but unbelievably smooth.

[KillerCelt]

Originally Posted by ninjavanish

Or a sun grown double chateau

[ninjavanish]

Originally Posted by icehog3

Opinions may vary.

Try lots of cigars, then smoke what you like, like what you smoke.

Absolutely right.


And ill admit I stereotyped cc's there w bit but the point I was trying to make is that simply being a cc does not make a cigar complex. In fact I tend to think more the opposite... At least in many cases.

Not to say they are bad cigars by any means because there are tons that I like... But from a shear complexity standpoint... I cant help but feel this battle is being won by nc's rather than cc's.

But as as you said. Opinions vary... And when it all comes down to it... Smoke what you like! And enjoy!

[longknocker]

Originally Posted by ninjavanish

Absolutely right.


And ill admit I stereotyped cc's there w bit but the point I was trying to make is that simply being a cc does not make a cigar complex. In fact I tend to think more the opposite... At least in many cases.

Not to say they are bad cigars by any means because there are tons that I like... But from a shear complexity standpoint... I cant help but feel this battle is being won by nc's rather than cc's.

But as as you said. Opinions vary... And when it all comes down to it... Smoke what you like! And enjoy!

Good Points, Brother! The Double SG Fuente Was Probably The First Cigar I Really Fell In Love With; I Had Forgotten About It After Smoking Mostly Tats, Illusiones, &+ Viajes!

[Salvelinus]

Originally Posted by akumushi

Stay away from petit robustos, robustos and toros, if you're looking for dynamics. I find that their short length and wide girth actually makes them much more consistant in flavor from start to finish. They can still be complex, in the sense that you get many layers of flavor at once, but this profile tends to remain consistant throughout the cigar.

But Clayton, that's the sweet spot. It's the only spot worth smoking

[akumushi]

Originally Posted by ninjavanish

Ok fine.

So you don't like cremosas.

But in all seriousness... I don't think you need vary off into Liga Privada land or into the realm of tatauje or illusione or any real boutique cigars to find what you're looking for.

Believe me when i say I don't have anything against tatuaje or illusione but i feel like if you're looking for something with complexity then you need look no further than a fuente chateau queen b... Or a sun grown double chateau

Or perhaps maybe something as simple as a nc fonseca 5-5 maduro.

There are tons and tons of cigars out there that offer complexity. I feel like people get a little too enamored with the tatuaje and illusione and the marketing whizzes that they forget about some of the cigars that have been around... Possibly in semi-obscurity, for years and years.

For instance... I don't think you even need to mention the name tatuaje or even the thought of a cc (as it seems some have) to agree that the world of nc's offers a vastly wider variety of blends, bodies, flavor, complexity, and uniqueness.

Ive got nothing against cc's but i cant help but feel like they have been so far surpassed in quality and variety by nc's since the cigar boom that the only real appeal they have is merely their unique puro identity of isom tobacco.

I don't know really, obviously everyones tastes are different but I feel like the replies in this thread have been so repetitive that someone ought to say

"branch out! Find a complex cigar that YOU like... For yourself! The journey to that discovery will be as intriguing as the discovery itself!"

Not at all trying to be inflammatory to any of the botls who previously posted... Whose opinions i respect greatly... Simply trying to offer some different points of view.

I certainly agree that Fuente and Padron get less love than they really ought to, but that is not to say that the boutique brands are not putting out an excellent product that satisfies a lot of people.
Also, as far as NC vs CC complexity goes, I would say that NCs have a chewier, more complex mouthfeel, whereas a lot of CCs have a unique but less varied and slightly thinner mouthfeel. If I were a pure mouth-smoker I'd agree that NCs are more complex.
However, when you get into the nose and really start snorking the cigar, I can't honestly take anyone seriously who says NCs are more complex than CCs. Most NCs are either flat and devoid of aroma, or a shot of pure burning pepper in the nose. The reason I smoke mostly CCs is because in my experience there is nothing as rich and varied on the retro-exhale than Cuban tobacco.
Since mouthfeel generally stays consistant from start to finish, and I find most of the development of a cigar is in the nuances and faint aromas in the nose, in the context of the OP, where he asks for dynamics, CCs will still win hands down for me everytime.
The trick to finding cigars you like is trying a wide variety, and I would challenge any smoker that discounts the depth of variety of either side, CC or NC, to try a wider swath of the market before saying that one is or is not varied or complex. They both have their relative strengths and weaknesses.

[weak_link]

Originally Posted by akumushi

The reason I smoke mostly CCs is because in my experience there is nothing as rich and varied on the retro-exhale than Cuban tobacco.

This crystallizes my feelings on CC's and why my vino and humidors are stocked nearly 98% with them. I was hoping I had missed something along the way the last few years but I keep going back to my commie sticks for all the reasons you've stated.

[Bill86]

Originally Posted by akumushi

Most NCs are either flat and devoid of aroma, or a shot of pure burning pepper in the nose.

I don't know about them being devoid of aroma as my allergies have my nose smelling for S*it 50% of the year, but I will agree many times have I received a VERY hot blast of pepper throughout my nose. So for the most part when I smoke NC's I'll retro exhale maybe 1-2 times per 1/3 and that's it. I will say CC's, well the 7-8 different ones I've smoked, are much easier on the nose. I still feel I am too much of a noob to comment on complexity so I won't. But I still can understand that if you are a nasal smoker CC's would be a better experience for you. However I think if you smoke purely mouth or mostly, you probably would smoke closer to fifty-fifty NC/CC.

[RevSmoke]

Originally Posted by weak_link

I'm not familiar with the Coronados, fantastic!

edit** just looked this one up, I see it's a LFD. The chisel is one of the only cigars to sit my butt back down and then turn me green. Is the Coranados in the same league in terms of Vita N?

Originally Posted by Ismith75

Try the corona or the churchill. The churchill is unreal.

Originally Posted by Emjaysmash

No, these aren't as full of Vitamin N. also, they're a lot better then the LFDs IMHO.

Originally Posted by Ismith75

My thoughts exactly. You wouldn't know it's something from LG without the name. Full bodied but unbelievably smooth.

Coronados are complex, with a wonderful aroma, some sweetness and spice. The nic hit isn't in the same league as the LFD DL line. And personally, I normally am not a fan of any of the LFDs except for the Air Benders. You can keep the rest of them as far as I am concerned.

If you want to get into some more money, then I'd suggest the Litto Gomez Diez lines, they also have some great flavors and wonderful complexity.

Peace of the Lord be with you.

[akumushi]

Originally Posted by Bill86

I don't know about them being devoid of aroma as my allergies have my nose smelling for S*it 50% of the year, but I will agree many times have I received a VERY hot blast of pepper throughout my nose. So for the most part when I smoke NC's I'll retro exhale maybe 1-2 times per 1/3 and that's it. I will say CC's, well the 7-8 different ones I've smoked, are much easier on the nose. I still feel I am too much of a noob to comment on complexity so I won't. But I still can understand that if you are a nasal smoker CC's would be a better experience for you. However I think if you smoke purely mouth or mostly, you probably would smoke closer to fifty-fifty NC/CC.

I totally agree. It's a pet theory of mine that NCs appeal to mouth smokers whereas most CC smokers prefer smoking nasally. I just got over a cold and have lingering nasal congestion and I've been sticking to NCs because it would simply be a waste to smoke a CC if I can't smell, whereas with an NC I can get close to full enjoyment by smoking out of the mouth with only a dozen or so short snorks throughout the cigar. The flavors are not quite as rich without a keen sense of smell, but it's acceptable.
The interesting thing is, I find that I have to have a completely different approach/technique of smoking between NC and CC. With NCs I blow the smoke out over a curled tongue with a lapping motion, maybe even swishing the smoke around a little, then puff a tiny bit of smoke out at the end, whereas CCs get a big snork up front and a tiny bit of a taste as I blow out the remaining smoke.

[Bill86]

I'm in the same boat as you, which is why I haven't had a CC in a good month or so. Maybe even longer than that. But my sinuses are clearly up quite nicely so maybe on a good day if it's warm out I'll be able to start enjoying CC's. Tennessee plays hell on my allergies which I never had before I moved here.

[icehog3]

Originally Posted by akumushi

I totally agree. It's a pet theory of mine that NCs appeal to mouth smokers whereas most CC smokers prefer smoking nasally.

I don't think it's a "pet theory" at all, Clayton, lots of my smoking friends and I think that is the case as well.

[weak_link]

I should have also mentioned that my preferred cigar size is roughly a corona. I''m maxed out at 50 ring. That alone limits the field considerably in NC's.

[rizzle]

I nasally smoke everything. I just can't understand how so many people feel that blowing smoke through your nose from a cigar of non cuban origin can't be done. Or isn't done. Maybe I've just got a really, insanely strong nasal passage. Or not.

[tsolomon]

Originally Posted by ninjavanish

Absolutely right.


And ill admit I stereotyped cc's there w bit but the point I was trying to make is that simply being a cc does not make a cigar complex. In fact I tend to think more the opposite... At least in many cases.

Not to say they are bad cigars by any means because there are tons that I like... But from a shear complexity standpoint... I cant help but feel this battle is being won by nc's rather than cc's.

But as as you said. Opinions vary... And when it all comes down to it... Smoke what you like! And enjoy!

I'm at the point where comparing the two just doesn't work for me. I find that CC's are a better smoke start to finish for taste and complexity and with most NC's, I only enjoy the first half before they become one dimensional in taste and complexity. I'm also at the point where there are just too many NCs being introduced to try keeping up with all the new ones being introduced.