The Wine Thread - Page 14

landhoney · 02-02-2009, 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rizzle

QPR=??

Quality (to) Price Ratio.

rizzle · 02-02-2009, 12:36 PM

Thanks Seth. So a "QPR label" would be considered a value, budget, or everyman's wine I assume.

landhoney · 02-02-2009, 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rizzle

Thanks Seth. So a "QPR label" would be considered a value, budget, or everyman's wine I assume.

Yes, with the implied addition that what you are paying for gets you better quality than most bottles of similar price. The quality is better than expected just based on price.

mosesbotbol · 02-02-2009, 12:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rizzle

Thanks Seth. So a "QPR label" would be considered a value, budget, or everyman's wine I assume.

Just a good value for the money... Does not assume an "everyman's wine", as everyone has a different pocketbook.

A million dollar painting for 250K is an excellent QPR, but above most our means ...

rizzle · 02-02-2009, 12:56 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by landhoney

Yes, with the implied addition that what you are paying for gets you better quality than most bottles of similar price. The quality is better than expected just based on price.

Understood.

Quote:

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

Just a good value for the money... Does not assume an "everyman's wine", as everyone has a different pocketbook.

A million dollar painting for 250K is an excellent QPR, but above most our means ...

And understood.

rizzle · 02-13-2009, 01:18 PM

Not a huge champagne guy...but had a bottle of Bernard Bremont Grand Cru a couple of nights ago and I must admit it was very tasty. Cost me like $40 and tasted much better to me than higher priced stuff I've had.

Any of you guys have any input on that one?

02-27-2009, 09:36 AM

Had a reference to this wine in the cheap wine thread. Check out the alcohol level, it looks like 15.4%, this is almost like a port!

You have to be on a list to buy it.

mosesbotbol · 02-27-2009, 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BC-Axeman

Had a reference to this wine in the cheap wine thread. Check out the alcohol level, it looks like 15.4%, this is almost like a port!

You have to be on a list to buy it.

Not going to age like port. Generally, the high alcohol wines are to chase the high initial scores; with little thought to what they will taste like in 10-20 years. There's not enough acid for the long haul.

High alcohol wines like this are not as food friendly either.

Certainly tragedy to have pinot that high in alcohol; should be against the law!

02-27-2009, 10:24 AM

I find that high alcohol only means the grapes had a lot of sugar to begin with. This varies by region and picking time. I have heard that in France it is acceptable to add sugar to up the alc. and in hot regions they remove alc. to get a more complete fermentation. For some reason I don't have any wines older than 15 years.

TheRiddick · 02-27-2009, 02:44 PM

I am not sure I would agree some points above. There are many vineyards around, both here and in Europe, where sugars go up and acids do not come down as the fruit ripens on the vine. One needs to wait until acidity comes down to workable levels and this forces winemakers' hands in some cases. Key is still balance and numbers don't mean much when the overall balance works. Or doesn't.

Burgundy has traditionally added sugar to bump up the alcohol, not only Burgundy actually. Yet no Burg-head ever wants to discuss this or admit to it.

What percentage of dry wines is capable of as good an aging as Port? And last I checked, not all Ports have same aging ability.

Best Bordeaux houses use very ripe fruit, same ripeness levels as here, but they also use RO machines to get the alcohol out prior to bottling. They also figured out that to get the mouth feel and flavor they want, that's the game they must play. LLC (Leoville Las Cases) is prime example of that, yet I have not heard one bad review so far.

KB Pinots are what they are, well made wines made for (rather) earlier consumption. They are still too young as a winery to figure out how they age, although owners will also tell you to drink them now if that's how you like them. I've tasted through barrels a good number of times, a few time each vintage, the fruit profile is seriously good, IMO. And the wines are getting better and better with each new vintage, they are dialing in oak programs and winemaking techniques. Alcohol numbers? I do not pay attention unless alcohol is the first thing that hits me when I taste a wine and in KB I do not get that.

Anyone had August West Pinots? Rivers Marie? AP Vin? Curious to hear your notes on those.

02-27-2009, 03:11 PM

I read an article about "what the winemakers don't want you to to know" a while back. I decided I didn't really want to know it either.
The end product speaks for itself. I'll leave it to he pros to decide the best way to get there.

05-07-2009, 01:16 PM

A couple weeks ago, I took out a client & he introduced me to the world of Orin Swift wines.

http://www.orinswift.com/

He suggested we order the 2005 Papillon. It's a Bordeaux-style blend, very full & jammy with a pretty nifty and unusual label. Also look for the butterfly ("papillon" means butterfly in French) at the bottom of the bottle in the dimple at the bottom of a wine bottle that is called the 'punt'.

The wine was absolutely delicious.

Quote:

Ruby red with notes of campfire, toast and sweet vanilla. On the palette - wild strawberry, rhubarb, and sassafras. And the finish - 30 plus seconds with an impression of cherry pie.

They also make "The Prisoner", also a blend, which I've since had and enjoyed but Papillon is definitely the better of the two, and more costly.

Quote:

The 2007 "Prisoner" blends the lush berry flavors of Zinfandel, the power and concentration of Cabernet Sauvignon, the dark black fruit of Syrah, the intensity and structure of Petite Sirah, the flesh of Charbono, and a hint of Grenache - all combined for a decadent wine with great complexity.

Orin Swift wines are pretty hard to find but I picked up a few bottles at Whole Foods in Redondo Beach. $50/each if you buy 6 total bottles for the '06 Papillon (the '05 we had in the restaurant is sold out) & $30 for The Prisoner. Considerably more than I normally spend on wine but definitely worth the occasional splurge.

And I've heard if you find these wines, get 'em while you can. They run in limited supplies and once they're out of any given vintage, they're out.

TheRiddick · 05-07-2009, 09:15 PM

Orin Swift is in every decent wine store you care to name. How many pallets do you need?

05-07-2009, 09:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRiddick

Orin Swift is in every decent wine store you care to name. How many pallets do you need?

It's a good thing for my liver that I can't afford pallets of wine.

Or crates of cigars.

Or trophy women.

Or... dang.

Life is still good!

MedicCook · 05-07-2009, 09:31 PM

I have been trying to find a wine I had in Germany made by the Deppisch family for a few years now. I stayed at the Hotel Anker which they also own and the wine they served in their restaurant was great.

TheRiddick · 05-08-2009, 12:34 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MedicCook

I have been trying to find a wine I had in Germany made by the Deppisch family for a few years now. I stayed at the Hotel Anker which they also own and the wine they served in their restaurant was great.

I am guessing a Riesling? Try calling Dee Vine in San Francisco, if they are unable to find the wine for you, then I am guessing it is not imported into USA. They are THE shop for German Riesling.

http://www.dvw.com/

mosesbotbol · 05-08-2009, 06:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MedicCook

I have been trying to find a wine I had in Germany made by the Deppisch family for a few years now. I stayed at the Hotel Anker which they also own and the wine they served in their restaurant was great.

Call the hotel and ask them for the name and if they have a US distributor.

MedicCook · 05-08-2009, 08:29 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheRiddick

I am guessing a Riesling? Try calling Dee Vine in San Francisco, if they are unable to find the wine for you, then I am guessing it is not imported into USA. They are THE shop for German Riesling.

http://www.dvw.com/

Quote:

Originally Posted by mosesbotbol

Call the hotel and ask them for the name and if they have a US distributor.

I sent them an email a few years ago and they were not selling it to the US. What I need to do is take another trip to Germany.

mosesbotbol · 05-08-2009, 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by MedicCook

I sent them an email a few years ago and they were not selling it to the US. What I need to do is take another trip to Germany.

If you are that hot on this wine, just buy a case and have it shipped. I would suggest doing this after October. There's some big internet wine stores based out of Germany.

TheRiddick · 05-09-2009, 12:19 AM

Ryan,

As Moses already pointed out there is another option. You need to call Adventures in Wine, they are based here in Bay Area and specialize in importing private purchases. All you have to do is order direct from the German producer, Adventures in Wine will then handle importing paperwork for customs and such. Have no idea if it is worth the effort, money wise, but something you can take a look at.

Try buying a few different bottles of JJ Prum or Dr. Loosen, I am almost sure you may find them at least as good as what you have tasted in Germany and probably better. They are the two producers you can bet money on, year in and year out, and the wines are outstanding in every respect, they age incredibly well to boot.

Do you recall flavor profile of the wine you liked? How much sugar was in it? Or rather, how mcuh did your palate detect?

02-02-2009, 12:36 PM	#262
rizzle Order Restored Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: st pete, fl Posts: 2,679 Trading: (23)	Re: The Wine Thread Thanks Seth. So a "QPR label" would be considered a value, budget, or everyman's wine I assume.

02-13-2009, 01:18 PM	#266
rizzle Order Restored Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: st pete, fl Posts: 2,679 Trading: (23)	Re: The Wine Thread Not a huge champagne guy...but had a bottle of Bernard Bremont Grand Cru a couple of nights ago and I must admit it was very tasty. Cost me like $40 and tasted much better to me than higher priced stuff I've had. Any of you guys have any input on that one?

02-27-2009, 09:36 AM	#267
BC-Axeman Guest Posts: n/a	Re: The Wine Thread Had a reference to this wine in the cheap wine thread. Check out the alcohol level, it looks like 15.4%, this is almost like a port! You have to be on a list to buy it.

02-27-2009, 10:24 AM	#269
BC-Axeman Guest Posts: n/a	Re: The Wine Thread I find that high alcohol only means the grapes had a lot of sugar to begin with. This varies by region and picking time. I have heard that in France it is acceptable to add sugar to up the alc. and in hot regions they remove alc. to get a more complete fermentation. For some reason I don't have any wines older than 15 years.

02-27-2009, 02:44 PM	#270
TheRiddick Non-believer Join Date: Jan 2009 First Name: Greg Location: Las Vegas Posts: 943 Trading: (7)	Re: The Wine Thread I am not sure I would agree some points above. There are many vineyards around, both here and in Europe, where sugars go up and acids do not come down as the fruit ripens on the vine. One needs to wait until acidity comes down to workable levels and this forces winemakers' hands in some cases. Key is still balance and numbers don't mean much when the overall balance works. Or doesn't. Burgundy has traditionally added sugar to bump up the alcohol, not only Burgundy actually. Yet no Burg-head ever wants to discuss this or admit to it. What percentage of dry wines is capable of as good an aging as Port? And last I checked, not all Ports have same aging ability. Best Bordeaux houses use very ripe fruit, same ripeness levels as here, but they also use RO machines to get the alcohol out prior to bottling. They also figured out that to get the mouth feel and flavor they want, that's the game they must play. LLC (Leoville Las Cases) is prime example of that, yet I have not heard one bad review so far. KB Pinots are what they are, well made wines made for (rather) earlier consumption. They are still too young as a winery to figure out how they age, although owners will also tell you to drink them now if that's how you like them. I've tasted through barrels a good number of times, a few time each vintage, the fruit profile is seriously good, IMO. And the wines are getting better and better with each new vintage, they are dialing in oak programs and winemaking techniques. Alcohol numbers? I do not pay attention unless alcohol is the first thing that hits me when I taste a wine and in KB I do not get that. Anyone had August West Pinots? Rivers Marie? AP Vin? Curious to hear your notes on those.

02-27-2009, 03:11 PM	#271
BC-Axeman Guest Posts: n/a	Re: The Wine Thread I read an article about "what the winemakers don't want you to to know" a while back. I decided I didn't really want to know it either. The end product speaks for itself. I'll leave it to he pros to decide the best way to get there.

05-07-2009, 09:15 PM	#273
TheRiddick Non-believer Join Date: Jan 2009 First Name: Greg Location: Las Vegas Posts: 943 Trading: (7)	Re: The Wine Thread Orin Swift is in every decent wine store you care to name. How many pallets do you need?

05-07-2009, 09:31 PM	#275
MedicCook Mila smoked my cigar Join Date: Jan 2009 First Name: Ryan Location: Schaghticoke, NY Posts: 10,946 Trading: (7)	Re: The Wine Thread I have been trying to find a wine I had in Germany made by the Deppisch family for a few years now. I stayed at the Hotel Anker which they also own and the wine they served in their restaurant was great. __________________ 27 World Series Championship's "If your wife doesn't like the aroma of your cigar, change your wife.", Zino Davidoff

05-09-2009, 12:19 AM	#280
TheRiddick Non-believer Join Date: Jan 2009 First Name: Greg Location: Las Vegas Posts: 943 Trading: (7)	Re: The Wine Thread Ryan, As Moses already pointed out there is another option. You need to call Adventures in Wine, they are based here in Bay Area and specialize in importing private purchases. All you have to do is order direct from the German producer, Adventures in Wine will then handle importing paperwork for customs and such. Have no idea if it is worth the effort, money wise, but something you can take a look at. Try buying a few different bottles of JJ Prum or Dr. Loosen, I am almost sure you may find them at least as good as what you have tasted in Germany and probably better. They are the two producers you can bet money on, year in and year out, and the wines are outstanding in every respect, they age incredibly well to boot. Do you recall flavor profile of the wine you liked? How much sugar was in it? Or rather, how mcuh did your palate detect?