Molecular Sieve Desiccant Bead Question

[emopunker2004]

Nice review

[Dunkel]

Maybe I can help you out...



You're welcome

[OLS]

Paging Mr. Head...

[the nub]

Originally Posted by lenguamor

Donuts.

I'm here for the donuts

Hello,
Did you ever get the info you need on Molecular Sieve Desiccant? I have specs for you and let me know if you have any questions. http://www.deltaadsorbents.com/msds.html Customerservice@delataadsorbents.com

[massphatness]

Originally Posted by Delta Adsorbents

Hello,
Did you ever get the info you need on Molecular Sieve Desiccant?

Welcome to Cigar Asylum!

Please stop in and introduce yourself HERE

[kaisersozei]

View #575, Post #27

I have no idea on an answer to the OP, but I didn't want to disappoint him by not posting. This has the potential to be my new favorite thread.

[area51]

Originally Posted by Delta Adsorbents

Hello,
Did you ever get the info you need on Molecular Sieve Desiccant? I have specs for you and let me know if you have any questions. http://www.deltaadsorbents.com/msds.html Customerservice@delataadsorbents.com

Really?

[shilala]

Your question is tough to answer, so I'll go on what I think you're asking.
The size of the bead does not affect the dessicant's function of holding moisture at all, and I'm speaking in terms of the singular bead.
When different meshes are employed in different arrangements, the ability of the dessicant's function can be severely decreased, or conversely, arranged in a fashion that takes advantage of the dessicant's principles and maximize their efficacy.
For instance, and I'll only bother you with one, if a person places 4" of beads in a 12"x12" tray, he will gain almost no more reactivity or function than that of a person who places an inch of beads in the same tray. After an inch of depth, the smallest meshes are severely impaired in their ability to transfer water vapor, but it's just a simple mechanical blockage. It's no fault of the beads.
That statement has to be taken in an educated context, because if a person is using a much larger mesh, that depth of efficacy increases with the mesh size. Those are the types of things that one tests for when engineering a product so that the design of the final product takes full advantage of the dessicant's efficacy, and is not wasting a bunch of beads that aren't doing anything that's worth having them present.
It all goes to surface area, vapor pressure, airflow and lots of math.

[WittyUserName]

Scott, did you just black out and start typing?

I do that sometimes but I buy things on the internet

[shilala]

That stuff up there actually means sh1t, Adam.
Now that I woke up and read the OP's question again, the answer is even correct.

[WittyUserName]

Originally Posted by shilala

That stuff up there actually means sh1t, Adam.
Now that I woke up and read the OP's question again, the answer is even correct.

I know I was making an "old school" reference. A very lame attempt

[markem]

Originally Posted by Delta Adsorbents

Hello,
Did you ever get the info you need on Molecular Sieve Desiccant? I have specs for you and let me know if you have any questions. http://www.deltaadsorbents.com/msds.html Customerservice@delataadsorbents.com

He is actually looking for information relative to holding a specific humidity +/- a small percent. So he needs a material that will both absorb when the RH is above the set point and smoothly release when the RH is below the set point. From your material, it appears that your products are absorption only. The process of regeneration appears to be the process for removing the water from the bead, which indicates to me that it locks what it has absorbed and so will have a limit/lifetime. Of course, I may be misinterpreted this statement from the 3A page:

3A Molecular Sieve regenerated and reused. To regenerate the sieve you need to remove the adsorbed moisture and other materials. To regenerate 3A Molecular Sieve heat to 250℃.

The application (humidity control for cigars) does not lend itself to periodically raising the temperatures to 250*C. Still, I really like your product and your MSDS is excellent!

[icehog3]

I like turtles.

[CigarNut]

Originally Posted by icehog3

I like turtles.

With or without pecans?

[icehog3]

Originally Posted by CigarNut

With or without pecans?

Mine all have tails.

[shilala]

Originally Posted by markem

He is actually looking for information relative to holding a specific humidity +/- a small percent. So he needs a material that will both absorb when the RH is above the set point and smoothly release when the RH is below the set point. From your material, it appears that your products are absorption only. The process of regeneration appears to be the process for removing the water from the bead, which indicates to me that it locks what it has absorbed and so will have a limit/lifetime. Of course, I may be misinterpreted this statement from the 3A page:

3A Molecular Sieve regenerated and reused. To regenerate the sieve you need to remove the adsorbed moisture and other materials. To regenerate 3A Molecular Sieve heat to 250℃.

The application (humidity control for cigars) does not lend itself to periodically raising the temperatures to 250*C. Still, I really like your product and your MSDS is excellent!

Mark, most curves simply show adsorption, because that's how/why the material is being sold and purposed.
When they're talking regeneration here, they're speaking of regeneration after using it in a specific manufacturing process, such as gathering ammonia from air, or any of a host of items, beit chlorine, argon, whatever.
When used in process piping inside air driers/scavengers, it can be "cleaned" or "made new" by steam cleaning it, then drying it via vacuum. It saves money.
(Molecular Sieve is also special in that it works at very high temperatures, over 1000 degrees in process piping. The steam part is key to "cleanning" it.)

Desiccant manufacturers/salesmen aren't privy to using dessicants the way we do in humidors, nor would they want to. It's not the purpose for which they manufacture and sell the stuff, and none of their concern. I know that because I asked, and a number of people in the business took interest in my trials when I developed HCM beads. They shared a lot of useful information with me as I traded useful information with them.
Clearly I'm not saying that none of them could possibly know, I only talked to a lot, not every. But none that I spoke to had a clue and I spent hours upon hours on the phone.

Regardless, a person can easily find these things out by purchasing a number of different dessicants and testing them. It just takes lots of time and money, but it's big time geek fun.

[OLS]

Mr. Richard Head.....

Paging Mr. Virginia....Mr. Wes Virginia.

[fencefixer]

Are you talking pore size or bead/pellet size? Those make a difference too.. I'm assuming you're wanting to use them in your humidor so here goes:

For what it's worth, I'm using 3 angstrom beads in about 2mm size and 4 angstrom beads in about 1mm size.. ordered them for my sons medications (he has many..) a while back, the leftovers I conditioned to 65% RH and they work like a charm in my coolers. Took a couple days of experimenting overnight with sponge in a tupperware box but it sure was worth the hassle I have to say. With this post I'm also expecting people to jump on a ***** train as to why I'm playing lottery with my cigars and why didn't I purchase a "proven" pre-fabricated product etc..

As to which pore size you should use.. I'd say both 3 and 4 angstrom would work since Ammonia is 3.6 angstrom, Carbon Monoxide is 2.8, Water is 3.2 etc. remember that it's not just water you want to pick up but stinkies too.. That's why it has its name "Molecular Sieve" it's because it won't let anything in the pores as they literally don't fit into the pores on a molecular level. I'm sure you know all this but I figured others might want some insight too. Good luck with your quest, I'm going to bed.

[Crownedone]

Waite....waite......I thought this was about donuts!.....didn't some one say there was going to be donuts here? No donuts....Then I am outa here.