cigar auctioneer vs. cbid?

[sammyboy405]

Just took a look at Cigar Auctioneer I normally goto cbids.. But Your right cbids is getting outta control on bid prices.

Cigar Auctioneer seems to be a bit more laid back than cbids.. and has a little more of a selection.

C****s I***********l has gotten out of hand. I've been buying from them for over 10 years. I was there when c**d started and the deals were tremendous.
But C* sells a lot of crap now. They haven't figured out how to get their big friends to really develop some well made house brands for them like Famous does. Everybody makes several house brands for Famous and most are excellent and well priced. And you can knock another 34%-50% by getting them on cigarauctioneer.
I visit c**d now and again and it's like people don't check what the C* retail is on those same cigars and they end up paying too much. C* must laughing all the way to the bank.
Patel makes a ton of cigars for C* but they are mostly cheap tasting cigars. On Famous, they are superb.

[JohnnyKay5]

I personally have a suspicion that people from CI/CBID have accounts and bid up prices (those that go above their store prices.) I also notice that CBID has more traffic. My general consensus is that Auctioneer has your best overall bidding structure. Its only down fall is sometimes the auctions start a little higher than i'd like. CBID is good for those onesies/twosies that you can not find on auctioneer and if you know what price is worth the bid.

Originally Posted by JohnnyKay5

I personally have a suspicion that people from CI/CBID have accounts and bid up prices (those that go above their store prices.) I also notice that CBID has more traffic. My general consensus is that Auctioneer has your best overall bidding structure. Its only down fall is sometimes the auctions start a little higher than i'd like. CBID is good for those onesies/twosies that you can not find on auctioneer and if you know what price is worth the bid.

Agree with you completely. Shills are everywhere.
The only upside to auctioneer starting the price too high, is very few people bid on them and I usually win at the starting price a couple bucks more....still saving 35% over the same thing at Famous Smoke

[swh127]

CA also warns you if you are going to bid above the price on their website. I don't think cbid does that.

Placed an order earlier this week on CBid, but looks like I could have gotten the same from significantly less from CA. Looks like I know where I will be going from here on out.

Cbid is alot like ebay. Sometimes you can get a deal and other times some moron bids something way beyond msrp.

[sammyboy405]

I Do like that feature that CA tells you when a bid is over MSRP.

[Dunkel]

I just used CA for the first time. Their shipping prices are higher than C-Bid, but as mentioned before they have stuff CI doesn't have. I remember when I could get good deals on C-bid, these days not so much.

[forgop]

Originally Posted by sammyboy405

I Do like that feature that CA tells you when a bid is over MSRP.

I don't know that a "feature" is needed to do that. If I'm on any auction site, whether it's ebay, CB, CA, etc, I ALWAYS shop around online to see what I can buy it for. Amazon, shopping.google.com, etc. are great. Specifically for cigars, I'll price shop the top 5 or so retailers I look for pricing and then decide what I'm willing to pay under the prices I've found. IMO, even if you get it at MSRP, I think you've paid too much.

I worked in procurement for 10 years of my life, so I might know a trick or two.

[Chemyst]

I use both, but CBid seems to get more of my business.
Know your prices so you don't overbid.

My bids start at 50% of the lowest price I can find online.
I'll check back on the day the auction ends, and if I really
want the smokes, I'll go up to 70% of the cheapest online
price. This usually does the trick, but if not, there's always
another deal coming along tomorrow or next week.

With shipping, the Singles are often waayyy overpriced.
You'd be better off calling a shpo for htf singles, imho.
A shpo would probably make up a sampler of htfs, cheaper
than you can get them on the auctions.

Some of my cigar buddies also bid at JRs and Thompson's
auctions, with good success. But they try to get $1.50 cigars
for 50 cents ea., usually not htfs or even popular brands. They
always try to convince me that some $.59 cigar is "just as good"
as my Pepin JJ maduro or CAO Brazilia... Sure! They're usually
very one dimensional smokes, but OK for nic fiends, I guess.

Chemyst

[d'am]

Originally Posted by forgop

I don't know that a "feature" is needed to do that. If I'm on any auction site, whether it's ebay, CB, CA, etc, I ALWAYS shop around online to see what I can buy it for. Amazon, shopping.google.com, etc. are great. Specifically for cigars, I'll price shop the top 5 or so retailers I look for pricing and then decide what I'm willing to pay under the prices I've found. IMO, even if you get it at MSRP, I think you've paid too much.

I worked in procurement for 10 years of my life, so I might know a trick or two.

I don't think it's intended for your benefit though. I'm sure Famous/CA make money from it.

Without the alert feature, they sell one box for over sticker price.

With the alert, the would-be high bidder instead goes to Famous to buy his box, and the original bidder wins a box at auction. This way, Famous/CA sell two boxes.

Assuming that all boxes are sold at a profit, I'd wager that Famous/CA make more money in the long-run with the "price alert" feature. While a few auctions go way over msrp, most are close enough in price that selling two boxes near msrp probably nets more profit.

Originally Posted by d'am

I don't think it's intended for your benefit though. I'm sure Famous/CA make money from it.

Without the alert feature, they sell one box for over sticker price.

With the alert, the would-be high bidder instead goes to Famous to buy his box, and the original bidder wins a box at auction. This way, Famous/CA sell two boxes.

Assuming that all boxes are sold at a profit, I'd wager that Famous/CA make more money in the long-run with the "price alert" feature. While a few auctions go way over msrp, most are close enough in price that selling two boxes near msrp probably nets more profit.

There's a method to the madness.
cigarbid has a base price for shipping around $4. But then they charge you either 25 cents or 50 cents for each additional item you've won. Even singles. So you can end up spending $8 for shipping.

On CA, it's a straight $5.99. But to make sure you never pay more than that, you must consolidate your winnings so that it ships once a week. If I win one or five bundles or 5 packs, it's only $5,99 for all of that.
But if I win three items in one day and don't have consolidation, they will charge you $5.99 three times, for one day!
I chose Tuesdays.
So you have to be strategic about your bidding. Switch to once a week...you can pick the day... and it just doesn't matter how much you win, it's a static shipping cost of $5.99. You need to go to the consolidation section under My Account on CA.

[Chemyst]

On a visit to the CI Mothership, home of CBid, I asked the sales guys
if they ever considered stopping the auctions, since they don't get
near retail on most auctions.

They said that the auctions are such a small percentage of their overall
sales that they don't even care, and wouldn't notice if the auctions were
discontinued or not.

Usually there are around 200+/- auctions each day. So not really that many
orders from the auctions. I guess catalog sales are much bigger.

fwiw

Chemyst

Originally Posted by Chemyst

On a visit to the CI Mothership, home of CBid, I asked the sales guys
if they ever considered stopping the auctions, since they don't get
near retail on most auctions.

They said that the auctions are such a small percentage of their overall
sales that they don't even care, and wouldn't notice if the auctions were
discontinued or not.

Usually there are around 200+/- auctions each day. So not really that many
orders from the auctions. I guess catalog sales are much bigger.

fwiw

Chemyst

Lesson #1
Big online cigar stores make a friggin' huge profits on most of their cigars. They are almost like jewelry stores. When I was young, I learned how to cut stones and make jewelry from a master in the jewelry section in downtown L.A. Mall and chain jewelry stores make an average of 400-600% profit on everything they sell. You buy a sweet ring for your honey for $1000. It cost them $150. Maybe.
I used to make a fortune designing, making and selling jewelry out of my home with only 100% profit.

The big cigar stores wheel and deal with the big manufacturers. "We'll give you X price on these cigars if you take these cigars off of our hands. Some big manufacturers won't do business with smaller outfits if they don't take what they give them.
So when a big outfit "proudly presents a new formula from X Cigars," they are probably ones forced down their throat.
Yes. Volume is a factor. But most cigar outfits don't have the luxury of volume and in order to stay in business, get outrageous deals on some of their cigars. Just a smaller function of what the big ones do.
The mark up isn't what the jewelry business is, but it ain't far behind.

So don't listen to the BS when a salesman tells you how much of a deal he's giving you.
There are exceptions. Start ups suffer a lot. Street cred is everything. If they make an excellent cigar, their profit margin is low in the beginning.
Remember, these products are primarily made in third world countries. Labor costs are low.
On the other hand, you have the manufacturers that are savvy business men. And they know if they over charge, it will affect their reputation. These are the companies that cigar making is in their soul...for generations.

Look at Brick House and Ambos Mundos. Good cigars that are exceedingly affordable. Smart marketing.

The auction houses are smart marketing for both CI and Famous. I don't care for JR.
They sell cigars at a reduced rate that averages 35%-50% off their retail. And they are still making a profit. Not much. But they ain't losing a dime.
And if you like the cigar, you're prone to buy it without going through the hassle of an auction.
Win/Win.
Look at me.
I get 1-1000 cigars for a review. If the cigar is exceptional, I go begging to my friends or family to buy a bundle or box for me. I'm always behind the game.
Buyer Beware!

[JohnnyKay5]

Two other things that need to be mentioned based on personal experiance. As mentioned above, shipping on singles isn't worth it. Also, at the 3 dollar increase on 5 packs added with shipping, its hardly a deal for me. When I'm bidding, I'm bidding to make a killing. Generally the price I end up buying at is between 2-3$ a stick, even with shipping added. Boxes is the way to go.


One other thing I noticed, pay day weekends. That's when not to bid because the yahoos with no concept of what anything costs come out of the woodwork and your deals vanish.

Originally Posted by JohnnyKay5

Two other things that need to be mentioned based on personal experiance. As mentioned above, shipping on singles isn't worth it. Also, at the 3 dollar increase on 5 packs added with shipping, its hardly a deal for me. When I'm bidding, I'm bidding to make a killing. Generally the price I end up buying at is between 2-3$ a stick, even with shipping added. Boxes is the way to go.


One other thing I noticed, pay day weekends. That's when not to bid because the yahoos with no concept of what anything costs come out of the woodwork and your deals vanish.

I agree, Johnny. Timing is everything. Saturday nights is a good time to bid.
Sunday morning is good if it's ending Sunday morning. Holidays are a good time as well.
I think the price of singles has exceeded the market value. I know exactly what you are buying for $2-$3. And they are 50 cent cigars.
At the other end, people are paying retail. The Decade goes for retail...sometimes more.
At this point in time, buying singles is just a convenience. It's a way to try something new short of a 5 pack. There are no deals.

I insist that the big difference between CI and CA is variety and choice. It seems like CI sells the same 30 cigars over and over. And half of it is low end stuff.
CA is a place for a little adventure. They have so many good house brands you can try at reasonable prices. Sure, you have to do your home work, but I can buy "Journey"....a bundle of 20 for $29. It's a house brand and with some aging is good solid cigar. You know what you get for $29 in box form at CI? That's right.

[JohnnyKay5]

Without giving away my auctions, just to be clear those $2-3 per stick auctions are all well known cigars that are on average $7-9 in B&M's.

Originally Posted by Katmancross

I agree, Johnny. Timing is everything. Saturday nights is a good time to bid.
Sunday morning is good if it's ending Sunday morning. Holidays are a good time as well.
I think the price of singles has exceeded the market value. I know exactly what you are buying for $2-$3. And they are 50 cent cigars.
At the other end, people are paying retail. The Decade goes for retail...sometimes more.
At this point in time, buying singles is just a convenience. It's a way to try something new short of a 5 pack. There are no deals.

I insist that the big difference between CI and CA is variety and choice. It seems like CI sells the same 30 cigars over and over. And half of it is low end stuff.
CA is a place for a little adventure. They have so many good house brands you can try at reasonable prices. Sure, you have to do your home work, but I can buy "Journey"....a bundle of 20 for $29. It's a house brand and with some aging is good solid cigar. You know what you get for $29 in box form at CI? That's right.