Fridge "reclamation" project (pic heavy)

[shilala]

Originally Posted by ChasDen

Is the "metal freezer body" part of the unit or just a box?

Can it be removed to just expose the coils you talk of?

How much condensation are we talking here, a gallon a day, a week a month?

Chas

Usually the coils are soldered onto the freezer body, or built in.
Not likely.
Did you see the ice clunker?
That's how much water vapor it'll rape from the air.
That's why we build closed systems for cigars, so we can maintain humidity without adding or removing water from the confined area.
If you collect water in a jug and then use a fan to recycle it back into the beads or air, you have a zero net loss/gain. That'd work. That's what you want.
If you keep taking water out, you gotta put it back in. That's a pain in the ass. You have to fill hydras, add sponges, and do all sorts of stuff, and you really never gain control or stability.
That's the problem I have with my big leaky display.
On the other hand, vinos and wine fridges work great if you plug the drain and let the fan run because the water constantly recycles itself.
This fridge can be made to work, but it'll take some ingenuity.
If the evaporator can't be cut down, all that freezer space will be lost because anything that touches it will get wet when it turns on.
A drip pan underneath could catch water, then a fan could be used to dry things and recycle the condensed water to the air, creating a zero net loss/gain of water.
There's all sorts of stuff that could be done, it just depends on that evaporator.
In that particular type of fridge, the INTENTION is for frost to build on the freezer section. That's what cools the fridge below and holds the condensed water (in ice form) from dripping on your food.
It's cause that's the way they work.
It's an old fridge, too. Through the years they devised lots better ways to do things.

Thanks for all the info Scott

Looks like a tough road ahead

Chas

[shilala]

Lots of good pics of the freezer section would help.
It looks like there's a drain in the back right corner. Just can't tell.
If I could jam my face in it, I could figure something out real quick.
It's just too far away.

[BigAsh]

Originally Posted by shilala

Lots of good pics of the freezer section would help.
It looks like there's a drain in the back right corner. Just can't tell.
If I could jam my face in it, I could figure something out real quick.
It's just too far away.

According to Google maps you're only 4 hrs 37 minutes away

Here's my thought, from a completely "ignorant of refrigeration properties" standpoint:...For most of the year, the area where it will be kept will be at house temps of 65-75 degrees so either the external controller won't kick in to run the condenser, or I can leave unplugged....for the summer, when it gets hot/humid around here the AC goes on so still should be in moderate temps, but when away from house, etc. the unit will need to be cooled...So, the condenser issue may not be that big a deal ....wait, let me adjust my rose-colored glasses.....anyway, I'll take a bunch of pics of the freezer unit and post 'em up soon

[AD720]

Originally Posted by BigAsh

According to Google maps you're only 4 hrs 37 minutes away

Here's my thought, from a completely "ignorant of refrigeration properties" standpoint:...For most of the year, the area where it will be kept will be at house temps of 65-75 degrees so either the external controller won't kick in to run the condenser, or I can leave unplugged....for the summer, when it gets hot/humid around here the AC goes on so still should be in moderate temps, but when away from house, etc. the unit will need to be cooled...So, the condenser issue may not be that big a deal ....wait, let me adjust my rose-colored glasses.....anyway, I'll take a bunch of pics of the freezer unit and post 'em up soon

Is there are option to keep it in your basement? I keep my coolers in the basement and I've never seen it go higher than 70 degrees.

Best of luck with the project. I used a similar fridge for a humi. Truth be told, my basement stayed a constant 65-70 degrees so I never plugged it in. A few strategically placed beads and a few fans and all was good. It stayed in the high 60s to low 70s all year round. Every year or so, I'd simply rotate the top shelf boxes to the bottom, etc.

Since it does insulate very well, be on the look out for mold if your RH% creeps up. Good luck!

[BigAsh]

Maybe....but if it comes out "cool", I want to show it off!

[shilala]

Originally Posted by BigAsh

So, the condenser issue may not be that big a deal ....wait, let me adjust my rose-colored glasses.....anyway, I'll take a bunch of pics of the freezer unit and post 'em up soon

It doesn't matter if the compressor only pushes for a few minutes, condensation will occur. It's just the way she goes.
Whether it's going to be a problem is a whole nother story.
Anything can be fixed.
A buddy of mine at work used to always say "it's impossible".
I'd answer him with "That's why we're here. You wanna go sit in the truck?"
Get them pics.

[BigAsh]

alrighty then.....I see what I'm doing tonite...... pics shortly!

[BigAsh]

Pics of the first coat of paint....a nice subtle RED....

[BigAsh]

Scott....here's the freezer pics.....
Coils underneath:




Coils on top:

[BigAsh]

Right side:


Above coil attaches to these screws on inside wall of freezer:


Attaches freezer at top:


There is a drip tray:



Scott, need more?....any add'l thoughts on condenser issues?....Thanks for your input....

[shilala]

K, Keith.
See those coils? That's what will get cold. Then they are glued, soldered, and clamped to the freezer body. It's most likely aluminum, because aluminum is almost as good as copper at transferring heat.
What you could do is tear off the freezer door, insulate the inside of the freezer with foam (like 1 inch blue stuff), seal that foam around the seams with silicone, then you could store stuff in the freezer section.
That'll keep and condenstaion from touching your stuff, but creates a very high liklihood of mold growing behind the foam.
If you can build a form inside the freezer out of wood, space it from the walls, and blow it full of canned foam, that'd be ultra-awesome. No mold, because there'd be no place for it to grow.

You could also simply build shelves in the freezer, and add a computer fan in there.
You'd have to be VERY careful that nothing (boxes, etc.) ever touches the sides, and be sure that there's plenty of sirculation for the fan to dry the condensation and return it to the air.

Now, the drip pan....
You somehow have to return any drip water to the air. Fans would do it. They make little 60 mm computer fans that'd work. They even have 40 mm fans that would work and be smaller.

It all depends where you put it. If it's in a warm area and it's gonna run a lot, there's going to be lots of condensate (water). If it's in a cool area, it'll run very little and need far less air movement to dry the condensed water and return it to your beads.

Yes, you can remove the freezer if you don't want any cooling. The coils that are on the freezer are where heat transfer happens. Inside those coils reside refrigerant.
To remove the coils from the freezer walls, bundle them, and use them as a chiller would work, but aluminum is VERY fragile. The odds of doing that without blowing a hole are about one in a million.

The best way to approach it is to finish it up, make your shelves or whatever, put beads in it, run it and see what happens.
Then you can make the necessary mods to make it work the way you want it to.
that's what I do.

The inherent design and particular formation of the freezer body and how it works is what's screwing you over. It's designed to condense and drip on the inside and outside of the freezer body so it keeps water off your food.
The ice that forms on/in the freezer is what cools the food below.
There's a thermostat below in the food section that drives the freezer unit to cool, thus ensuring the cycle.
The freezer section is the evaporator.
The coils on the back of your fridge are the condenser.
The compressor is underneath your fridge near the back.
Don't get "water condensing on the evaporator" confused with the condenser on the back of your fridge. It'll just make you more confused.
The reason they call the thing inside your fridge an evaporator (your freezer) is because that's where liquid refrigerant evaporates (inside those tubes) and gathers heat. It then carries the heat back to the compressor, is compressed and multiplied, then the heat is released in the condenser coil where it turns back to a liquid, and heads back to your freezer through an orifice where it "flashes" back to a saturated vapor and starts gathering heat again.
That's the confusing part, kinda. We think the freezer is "making cold", but it's actually carrying away heat.

So you either keep the freezer, or don't have any cooling.
Add some fans and see what happens.
The pains in the ass may be minimal, and might be easy to fix. Ultimately you might even be able to use the freezer section.
If nothing else, you could always use jar humis (beware, puff link) in the freezer section.

[BigAsh]

Originally Posted by shilala

K, Keith.
See those coils? That's what will get cold. Then they are glued, soldered, and clamped to the freezer body. It's most likely aluminum, because aluminum is almost as good as copper at transferring heat.
What you could do is tear off the freezer door, insulate the inside of the freezer with foam (like 1 inch blue stuff), seal that foam around the seams with silicone, then you could store stuff in the freezer section.
That'll keep and condenstaion from touching your stuff, but creates a very high liklihood of mold growing behind the foam.
If you can build a form inside the freezer out of wood, space it from the walls, and blow it full of canned foam, that'd be ultra-awesome. No mold, because there'd be no place for it to grow.

You could also simply build shelves in the freezer, and add a computer fan in there.
You'd have to be VERY careful that nothing (boxes, etc.) ever touches the sides, and be sure that there's plenty of sirculation for the fan to dry the condensation and return it to the air.

Now, the drip pan....
You somehow have to return any drip water to the air. Fans would do it. They make little 60 mm computer fans that'd work. They even have 40 mm fans that would work and be smaller.

It all depends where you put it. If it's in a warm area and it's gonna run a lot, there's going to be lots of condensate (water). If it's in a cool area, it'll run very little and need far less air movement to dry the condensed water and return it to your beads.

Yes, you can remove the freezer if you don't want any cooling. The coils that are on the freezer are where heat transfer happens. Inside those coils reside refrigerant.
To remove the coils from the freezer walls, bundle them, and use them as a chiller would work, but aluminum is VERY fragile. The odds of doing that without blowing a hole are about one in a million.

The best way to approach it is to finish it up, make your shelves or whatever, put beads in it, run it and see what happens.
Then you can make the necessary mods to make it work the way you want it to.
that's what I do.

The inherent design and particular formation of the freezer body and how it works is what's screwing you over. It's designed to condense and drip on the inside and outside of the freezer body so it keeps water off your food.
The ice that forms on/in the freezer is what cools the food below.
There's a thermostat below in the food section that drives the freezer unit to cool, thus ensuring the cycle.
The freezer section is the evaporator.
The coils on the back of your fridge are the condenser.
The compressor is underneath your fridge near the back.
Don't get "water condensing on the evaporator" confused with the condenser on the back of your fridge. It'll just make you more confused.
The reason they call the thing inside your fridge an evaporator (your freezer) is because that's where liquid refrigerant evaporates (inside those tubes) and gathers heat. It then carries the heat back to the compressor, is compressed and multiplied, then the heat is released in the condenser coil where it turns back to a liquid, and heads back to your freezer through an orifice where it "flashes" back to a saturated vapor and starts gathering heat again.
That's the confusing part, kinda. We think the freezer is "making cold", but it's actually carrying away heat.

So you either keep the freezer, or don't have any cooling.
Add some fans and see what happens.
The pains in the ass may be minimal, and might be easy to fix. Ultimately you might even be able to use the freezer section.
If nothing else, you could always use jar humis (beware, puff link) in the freezer section.

Thanks Scott...you are a wealth of knowledge and a fine BOTL!....I'm gonna try it and see what happens....I'm optimistic all will work out well in the end.....Next will be firming up with Chuck on shelves/drawers.....

[kgoings]

Did you finish this??

[BigAsh]

everything but the shelves!.....Chuck made some killer trays (his work is awesome) but my measurements were off a bit so we're still working thru it....its painted and storing boxes and five finger bags right now ......holding steady with 2 lbs of beads.... hoping to finish it completely soon!

[kgoings]

Originally Posted by BigAsh

everything but the shelves!.....Chuck made some killer trays (his work is awesome) but my measurements were off a bit so we're still working thru it....its painted and storing boxes and five finger bags right now ......holding steady with 2 lbs of beads.... hoping to finish it completely soon!

anymore pics?

[paris1129]

We want new pics!

[AD720]

[BigAsh]

hahahaha...........no pressure or anything!......I'll work on it!....Once Chuck and I figure out a fix, look out!