Do you "age" your coffee?

[md4958]

I dont home-roast, but I know many of you do. Do you age your beans after you roast them?

I find that when I get my beans that have just been roasted that morning, or even the day before, the crema on my espresso is not what it should be. You will see little bubbles in the crema, and it is easily broken.

When I spoke to my roaster (also my best friend) he said that espresso should age for a bit to expel any left over gasses. After hearing this i began experimenting. I find that I, and my customers, like espresso that has been aging for at least a month. All of our beans come in foil bags with one way valves.

Do any of you age your beans?

[King James]

I think the "prime" time is like a day or two after roasting. However, I think after about a week the beans start to decline in taste/quality. Mr. Moo or someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

[md4958]

Originally Posted by King James

I think the "prime" time is like a day or two after roasting. However, I think after about a week the beans start to decline in taste/quality. Mr. Moo or someone can correct me if I'm wrong.

Are you referring to your "drip" coffee or espresso?

[King James]

Originally Posted by md4958

Are you referring to your "drip" coffee or espresso?

I don't drip or espresso.... just french press. I was referring to the beans that I roast in general.

[replicant_argent]

Coffee "de-gasses" after roasting, with flavor peaking anywhere between 1 day and a week or so, depending on the bean origin and the roasting profile. After that, you are starting to drink stale coffee, or less flavorful coffee than you should. It also makes a difference in your grind size and uniformity.


Waits for Moo to expand on my simplistic answer.

[King James]

Originally Posted by replicant

Waits for Moo to expand on my simplistic answer.

me too!

paging mr moo....

[opus]

I use a vac pot and find 1 day to be perfect for me. Not sure for espresso.

Some espressos need to rest 48-72 hours after roasting. Experiment with what you are getting and track the roast date and when you get the best results.

[md4958]

Originally Posted by MaytagMan

Some espressos need to rest 48-72 hours after roasting. Experiment with what you are getting and track the roast date and when you get the best results.

My original post stated that I find that my espresso tastes the best after a 4-5 week de-gassing period in oneway valved bags. I feel that it is best served that way.

I was not asking for advice(no offense), but rather just curious if any of you age your beans? It may be different for me because I purchase my beans already roasted and bagged.

I would guess that many home roasters just let the beans sit out for a couple days?

Originally Posted by md4958

My original post stated that I find that my espresso tastes the best after a 4-5 week de-gassing period in oneway valved bags. I feel that it is best served that way.

I was not asking for advice(no offense), but rather just curious if any of you age your beans? It may be different for me because I purchase my beans already roasted and bagged.

I would guess that many home roasters just let the beans sit out for a couple days?

No offense taken - I misread your post, so my bad! In my experience, After a couple of weeks, it starts to lose its characteristics and start going stale. (I keep my coffee in one-way valved bags as well).

[dunng]

Originally Posted by MaytagMan

In my experience, After a couple of weeks, it starts to lose its characteristics and start going stale. (I keep my coffee in one-way valved bags as well).

Not in Moe's case, it was excellent the other week!

[Mister Moo]

As espresso brewing accentuates the good (and the not-good) character in any bean, blend or roast so, too, does it accentuate post-roast bean development called resting and subsequent staling. While I find the effect of resting less pronounced in drip, press or vac, it is certainly there. With espresso blends, however, the difference between a day or two (or five or seven, maybe) of rest can be very dramtic - the difference between grassy-green tasting and sweet-rich. This isn't some "maybe" thingie - it is profound and couldn't be missed by anyone with a tongue.

I can't say I ever had any espresso blend get better after more than about 7-10 days post roast; often they hang great for another week or so after they peak then slide, slowly into staleness I suppose. Can't say for sure 'cause I find the peak around 10-days with espresso so I plan my roast quantity and schedule around that. I don't roast a month ahead and I don't expend effort to figure out what combination of beans and roast profile peak longest and slowest. Know why? Because I don't have too. I just go out in the garage and roast some more whenever I want to. No telling what effort sharp commercial guys put into bean selection, roast profile and packaging to insure their stuff tastes good for as long as possible.

FWIW, whatever goes lame for espresso after "X" days still seems very good for drip. Big difference between espresso and drip "freshness".

Originally Posted by Mister Moo

As espresso brewing accentuates the good (and the not-good) character in any bean, blend or roast so, too, does it accentuate post-roast bean development called resting and subsequent staling. While I find the effect of resting less pronounced in drip, press or vac, it is certainly there. With espresso blends, however, the difference between a day or two (or five or seven, maybe) of rest can be very dramtic - the difference between grassy-green tasting and sweet-rich. This isn't some "maybe" thingie - it is profound and couldn't be missed by anyone with a tongue.
I can't say I ever had any espresso blend get better after more than about 7-10 days post roast; often they hang great for another week or so after they peak then slide, slowly into staleness I suppose. Can't say for sure 'cause I find the peak around 10-days with espresso so I plan my roast quantity and schedule around that. I don't roast a month ahead and I don't expend effort to figure out what combination of beans and roast profile peak longest and slowest. Know why? Because I don't have too. I just go out in the garage and roast some more whenever I want to. No telling what effort sharp commercial guys put into bean selection, roast profile and packaging to insure their stuff tastes good for as long as possible.

FWIW, whatever goes lame for espresso after "X" days still seems very good for drip. Big difference between espresso and drip "freshness".

Wise he is Mr. Moo.

A month to me is WAAAAYYY too long. I'm fortunate to live near one of the top coffee shops in the country, and get to speak with them often. (even though I homeroast, I enjoy their espresso blend so I stop in to pick some up every few weeks or so.)

They wouldn't sell, and I wouldn't purchase coffee that old, but that's just me.

[md4958]

Originally Posted by Resipsa

Wise he is Mr. Moo.

A month to me is WAAAAYYY too long. I'm fortunate to live near one of the top coffee shops in the country, and get to speak with them often. (even though I homeroast, I enjoy their espresso blend so I stop in to pick some up every few weeks or so.)

They wouldn't sell, and I wouldn't purchase coffee that old, but that's just me.

Espresso will retain its freshness for 6 months from roasting as long as it is in its sealed bag.

Once the bag is opened or breached, the shelf life decreases to one week.

Once ground, espresso will stale within half an hour. It will be difficult to get good flavor and crema if the coffee is more than 25-30 minutes old.

Originally Posted by md4958

Espresso will retain its freshness for 6 months from roasting as long as it is in its sealed bag.

Well, we disagree is all I can say, :

As evidenced by my favorite site about everything espresso.....and no, they aren't talking about ground coffee, LOL:

Relevant quote:

" Most serious enthusiasts feel that this shelf life is considerably less than a month, and many agree the shelf life at room temperature is limited to as little as 10 days after roasting. There is no evidence that simple valve bag packaging at room temperature significantly extends storage life for consumers who care about coffee freshness"
Full article:

http://www.home-barista.com/store-co...n-freezer.html

[md4958]

That is a relevent quote from where exactly?

So youre telling me that Illy and LaVazza, are all selling stale coffee to thier customers? It takes 2 to 3 weeks just to get from Italy to the states.

If you would like, I can send you two samples of espresso. One I will mark A, the other B. One will be a bag that I have aged for over a month. The other I will get the same day it was roasted... I will package it as soon as it cools. I will priority ship it to you so it will arrive in three days.

I'll bet you a fiver of cigars that you cant tell wich one is 3 days old and which is 5 weeks old.

Originally Posted by md4958

That is a relevent quote from where exactly?

So youre telling me that Illy and LaVazza, are all selling stale coffee to thier customers? It takes 2 to 3 weeks just to get from Italy to the states.

If you would like, I can send you two samples of espresso. One I will mark A, the other B. One will be a bag that I have aged for over a month. The other I will get the same day it was roasted... I will package it as soon as it cools. I will priority ship it to you so it will arrive in three days.

I'll bet you a fiver of cigars that you cant tell wich one is 3 days old and which is 5 weeks old.

I've got nothing against either Illy or LaVazza, both fine companies, but I don't buy their product for the reasons you state, nor do I buy Maxwell House whole bean coffee, or Folgers, or any of the mass produced brands/supermarket brands. For me it's either homeroast/local roasters or artisan roasters off the net, because they, to me, produce the best, freshest product. YMMV

You don't want to make that bet, And I don't touch espresso beans until 4 days post roast anyway, LOL

Did you read the article? Because if you hit the link provided, it will answer the question of where the information comes from.

[md4958]

Originally Posted by Resipsa

You don't want to make that bet,

I just did.

[md4958]

Originally Posted by Resipsa

Did you read the article? Because if you hit the link provided, it will answer the question of where the information comes from.

Sorry, my bad... didnt see the link there... but let me ask you again:

What makes that a relevent quote?

Home barista.com???

Seriously??

[replicant_argent]

OK, gentlemen, we need stakes, here...

Sounds like a Blind Espresso Tasting is on the pad, ready for launch!