Anyone have water softener know how?

[floydpink]

After seeing what Florida's water does to sinks, tubs, and appliances, I am ready to take the plunge into a water softener BEFORE replacing my water heater.

Florida's water is known to be quite colorful, but generally safe to drink due to the limestone it passes through and the chlorination needed to make it drinkable. Women complain it amkes washing tougher and hair not so soft. Me, I don't know.

Anyway, after getting installation prices of about $1,600, I took a trip to Lowes where they have a 40,000 grain one that will be less than half of that with a year of no interest payments.

My question is whether it's worth it to have them run pipes to put it in the garage instead of outside like many of my neighbors have theirs as well as any other considerations.

Thanks.

[pektel]

I have a water softener and reverse osmosis system. Both are installed in the basement near the furnace. They aren't very intrusive. I also hear that the lowe's/home depot ones do not last long. I had one from HD that lasted 3 years. My current one has a 25 year warranty, and a removeable display head that I can bring in for them to troubleshoot any potential issues, instead of paying for a house call.

For you Florida guys: A "furnace" is a device that burns fuel to keep you warm when it gets cold out.

[replicant_argent]

I was in the business for quite a while, both in service and sales. That being said, it depends on the actual unit as far as longevity and serviceability. We have to install them inside here, due to the lovely habit of running out of digits in the winter months, but I imagine you want to shelter it as best as possible from the elements, particularly if it is an electronic head versus a mechanical or simple electric timer. There are many scam water "treatments" out there, and quite frankly, they simply don't work. Ion exchange is pretty much where it is at now. The big differences in price should be valve components (brass and teflon vs. plastic and rubber seals, for instance, capacity, and a metered system rather than calendar. If you can send me some info on the equipment, I will try to evaluate them for you and help you make a decision as best I am able.

[floydpink]

Thanks. Looks like it's gonna have to be in the garage, which means drilling though concrete from the city water. That might make the labor high and cause me to deal with hard water.

Getting an estimate will be best.

I'm looking at the 40,000 grain Whirlpool one from Lowes.

[Matt-N-Ga]

If it helps at all, my mom and dad live in Jacksonville, and they have both the water softener and the Reverse Osmosis systems. The water softener was installed in the garage to ease use, and the osmosis system was installed on the main line from the street.

[G G]

I would just caution anyone to stay far far far away from rainsoft. I am not sure if they are bad everywhere or just here in Jacksonville but you DO NOT want to get sucked in by these thieves and liars. And I am not necessarily talking bad about rainsofts equipment but I do know you can get equipment that is as good as theirs for lots less money. I am talking about the company that has the service contract as being liars and thieves.

[Ashcan Bill]

For what it's worth I have a Whirlpool I bought at Lowes. I installed it in the garage around 5 years ago.

It's never missed a lick or given me a moment of trouble. I try to remember to add salt every so often.

I'm looking at tankless water heaters right now.

[floydpink]

Originally Posted by Ashcan Bill

For what it's worth I have a Whirlpool I bought at Lowes. I installed it in the garage around 5 years ago.

It's never missed a lick or given me a moment of trouble. I try to remember to add salt every so often.

I'm looking at tankless water heaters right now.

Good to know. It doesn't seem too complicated of a thing and if it's in the garage, I can keep a close eye on it.

Thanks.

[floydpink]

I'm certain I want it out of the sun and elements and in the garage.
I'm wondering if I can install the loop where the line feeds the water heater in the garage before the hot/cold water split?

[replicant_argent]

Originally Posted by floydpink

I'm certain I want it out of the sun and elements and in the garage.
I'm wondering if I can install the loop where the line feeds the water heater in the garage before the hot/cold water split?

Soften as much as you can, except the irrigation or hose bib feeds outside.
If you plan on adding an RO system at a later date, it will already be plumbed correctly. (ROs are fed with soft water)

[floydpink]

So Pete,

Is it a straightforward installation branching off the line going into the water heater without drilling through the outside where the hose bib is?

[replicant_argent]

Originally Posted by floydpink

So Pete,

Is it a straightforward installation branching off the line going into the water heater without drilling through the outside where the hose bib is?

Should be, if the plumbing is accessible there. Do you have access to the split from the mainline before the cold water feeds to the rest of the house? If so, you should be golden.

[BlackDog]

All of your appliances and plumbing will last longer with soft water. We also have softened and RO'd water here. It's a PITA, though, having to carry salt down to the basement level here in MN. I wish I could have mine in the garage. I've been considering putting heat in my garage, and that fact alone would be enough to motivate me to do it.

FWIW, mine is Ionics brand and has worked for the 8 years I've lived here without a flaw. It was installed when the house was new 12 years ago.

[floydpink]

My old condo had copper pipes which are outdated and not much used in Florida anymore. After resisting a repipe, i finally bit the bullet after 4 leaks. New house is all PEX plastic piping.

Apparantly the combination of the water and frequent lightning strikes is hell on copper.

I got to thinking about the water softener this week when I pulled off an old drain pipe and saw all the scale buildup.

Besides that, my skin is very dry and itchy and i think the water may be the cause.

Water cooler for our drinking and spring water for my espresso machine already.

I fill my Jacuzzi outside with city water and it's doing remarkably well after 6 years though.

[T.G]

Originally Posted by floydpink

My old condo had copper pipes which are outdated and not much used in Florida anymore. After resisting a repipe, i finally bit the bullet after 4 leaks. New house is all PEX plastic piping.

Apparantly the combination of the water and frequent lightning strikes is hell on copper.

I got to thinking about the water softener this week when I pulled off an old drain pipe and saw all the scale buildup.

Besides that, my skin is very dry and itchy and i think the water may be the cause.

Water cooler for our drinking and spring water for my espresso machine already.

I fill my Jacuzzi outside with city water and it's doing remarkably well after 6 years though.

When was the last time you changed the sacrificial anode in the water heater?

[floydpink]

Originally Posted by T.G

When was the last time you changed the sacrificial anode in the water heater?

Never and did the first flush today, so it's probably not too long before a new water heater will be on the list.

[wayner123]

One thing you may want to prepare for is where the drain hose will go. When placing outside, you can simply run it into the ground or make a small drain field. When it's in the garage, you will need to plumb for it. You will need to plan ahead as well for an electrical service for the unit.

I had Rainsoft in the past (yes I was once gullable and young) and dealt with the problems that arose from it. After a few years of that pain, I went out and built my own from scratch. In the end it cost ~$350. It was worth it to know how it all came together and it gave me much better service. I have sinced moved into a new home, and a new water softner is high on the list.

The Fleck 5600 models are rock solid, easy to repair, and there are many guides out there for it. IME, I would get the simple 12 day version. The metered version is nice, but it didn't save that much money for me. Plus it's one more thing that can go wrong on the unit.

[rizzle]

Originally Posted by wayner123

One thing you may want to prepare for is where the drain hose will go. When placing outside, you can simply run it into the ground or make a small drain field. When it's in the garage, you will need to plumb for it. You will need to plan ahead as well for an electrical service for the unit.

I had Rainsoft in the past (yes I was once gullable and young) and dealt with the problems that arose from it. After a few years of that pain, I went out and built my own from scratch. In the end it cost ~$350. It was worth it to know how it all came together and it gave me much better service. I have sinced moved into a new home, and a new water softner is high on the list.

The Fleck 5600 models are rock solid, easy to repair, and there are many guides out there for it. IME, I would get the simple 12 day version. The metered version is nice, but it didn't save that much money for me. Plus it's one more thing that can go wrong on the unit.

That's what we have. My plumber, who is a client of mine, installed it for us probably 6-7 years ago. I have a crawlspace under my house and the metal tank/cylinder thing is under there right after where the water line comes into the house and my salt tank is in my garage. Other than having to adjust the timer every couple of years from power outages, it has been trouble free.

And then when our water heater died we had a Rinnai tankless water heater put in that rocks.

[replicant_argent]

5600 valves should be rebuilt every 2 or 3 years for optimal performance, in my experience, while not the "best" valve out there, they are relatively cheap to purchase. A rebuild of the valve takes 40-ish minutes (being meticulous) or less (if you are handier) One of those "you get what you pay for" products. If you add up the maintenance costs over a typical service life, not the best value, but that depends on your priorities, such as budgetary, expected time you will own the home, etc.
If you find someone locally that carries Capital valved equipment, and has been around for a while, and uses high quality resins that agree with your local water chemistry instead of a generic resin, and the price isn't beyond value, you should be good. 20+ years before a rebuild wasn't as all uncommon IME. High quality valves and controls, the timers and motors gave very good service as well, occasionally a meter dome would need replacement, so if a calendar system would work for you, that is the most trouble free, I think. (barring power outages)

[floydpink]

Thanks everyone. Fleck 5600 getting installed in the morning.