Is Your Maduro Legit?

[ColdCuts]

It's common knowledge that "legit" maduro leaf is produced by spending more time on the plant, and once harvested, more time in fermentation. This explains why oftentimes the maduro version costs a bit more than the natural version of a given marca.

Perhaps it's less common knowledge that there are ways to produce a dark-looking "phony" maduro leaf. I've read that tobacco leaf can be quickly made dark by fermenting it at extraordinarily high temperatures; or by rolling wet tobacco leaves between the palms of the hands; or by, God forbid, artificial coloring.

Thing is, I don't know about you, but I can't tell by looking. Maybe I've only ever seen legit maduro wrappers. I don't know. Of course, manufacturers aren't going to volunteer the information unless they're producing maduro leaf the time-tested, old-fashioned way.

I don't want to assume that all inexpensive maduro bundles out there are made with phony maduro leaf, but then how do they do it? How do we know? I've heard it said that a dyed leaf will leave color on your fingers or lips when you smoke it. I've smoked a fair share of inexpensive maduro cigars, and that's never happened to me.

Can anyone shed some light?

[stearns]

Can't speak to specifics, but once you've had one that was dyed to the point that it comes off on your hands and lips, you definitely know for sure. Hasn't happened to me in many years, but it certainly has happened. Don't know if that's a changing of the times or that I don't buy out of the dollar bin anymore, but it's gross when it occurs

[T.G]

Originally Posted by ColdCuts

It's common knowledge that "legit" maduro leaf is produced by spending more time on the plant, and once harvested, more time in fermentation. This explains why oftentimes the maduro version costs a bit more than the natural version of a given marca.

Perhaps it's less common knowledge that there are ways to produce a dark-looking "phony" maduro leaf. I've read that tobacco leaf can be quickly made dark by fermenting it at extraordinarily high temperatures; or by rolling wet tobacco leaves between the palms of the hands; or by, God forbid, artificial coloring.

Thing is, I don't know about you, but I can't tell by looking. Maybe I've only ever seen legit maduro wrappers. I don't know. Of course, manufacturers aren't going to volunteer the information unless they're producing maduro leaf the time-tested, old-fashioned way.

I don't want to assume that all inexpensive maduro bundles out there are made with phony maduro leaf, but then how do they do it? How do we know? I've heard it said that a dyed leaf will leave color on your fingers or lips when you smoke it. I've smoked a fair share of inexpensive maduro cigars, and that's never happened to me.

Can anyone shed some light?

Maduro just means "ripe". It's also a color on the grading chart. A manufacturer can define a cigar as maduro by either definition. Or by any other, there really is no standard. It doesn't have to be a special or separate fermentation. You go to Padron for example and the x000 series cigars wrappers all come out of the same pilons. When a pilon is broken down the leaves are sorted by color and the darker ones are sold as maduro, the lighter ones as natural. Another example, JdN Antano's, are dark enough and fermented in such a way that they could be classified as maduros, yet, they don't describe/sell them that way.

Don't confuse the old maduro-matic ovens which basically cooked the leaves to a dark shade a few hours with a fermentation that occurs at a higher temp.

I've never heard of the "rubbing the leaves between your hands" thing. First off, the capa leaf is usually a very thin and delicate leaf, chosen in part because of it's ascetics. Rubbing this leaf between your hands would destroy it, you'd tear holes in it all over the place. This would render it unusable as a capa leaf. Also, there's no way your going to generate enough friction to heat it up and change the color, if you did it would likely be shredded in the process. I think what is causing the confusion here is from photos of the factories where just about everyone's hands are stained from handling tobacco for 8-10 hours a day.

The dye is a tricky one. It is used by some manufacturers to standardize color on the leaves so that all the cigars in a box and from box to box all look the same versus for example, Cuban cigars, where not only is it common to have two boxes with the same codes that don't have the same shade of wrapper leaf, you even have progression in colors within the same box. It can also used by some manufacturers to make their cigars look darker than they might be. Unfortunately, sometimes it can be hard to tell when it's used. Color coming off on your hands, if extreme, is probably dye, but if it's a lesser transfer, then it might or might not actually be dye and just the leaf itself. And sometimes dye doesn't come off - take the most famous dyed cigar: Partagas Black - they boil those leaves, that color will never rub off on your hands. So, unfortunately, having something come off on your hands isn't always a reliable indicator. Although, if it makes you feel better, the dye is typically made from the stalks of the tobacco plant and not some batch of artificial junk.

[CRIMPS]

Originally Posted by T.G

Maduro just means "ripe". It's also a color on the grading chart. A manufacturer can define a cigar as maduro by either definition. Or by any other, there really is no standard. It doesn't have to be a special or separate fermentation. You go to Padron for example and the x000 series cigars wrappers all come out of the same pilons. When a pilon is broken down the leaves are sorted by color and the darker ones are sold as maduro, the lighter ones as natural. Another example, JdN Antano's, are dark enough and fermented in such a way that they could be classified as maduros, yet, they don't describe/sell them that way.

Don't confuse the old maduro-matic ovens which basically cooked the leaves to a dark shade a few hours with a fermentation that occurs at a higher temp.

I've never heard of the "rubbing the leaves between your hands" thing. First off, the capa leaf is usually a very thin and delicate leaf, chosen in part because of it's ascetics. Rubbing this leaf between your hands would destroy it, you'd tear holes in it all over the place. This would render it unusable as a capa leaf. Also, there's no way your going to generate enough friction to heat it up and change the color, if you did it would likely be shredded in the process. I think what is causing the confusion here is from photos of the factories where just about everyone's hands are stained from handling tobacco for 8-10 hours a day.

The dye is a tricky one. It is used by some manufacturers to standardize color on the leaves so that all the cigars in a box and from box to box all look the same versus for example, Cuban cigars, where not only is it common to have two boxes with the same codes that don't have the same shade of wrapper leaf, you even have progression in colors within the same box. It can also used by some manufacturers to make their cigars look darker than they might be. Unfortunately, sometimes it can be hard to tell when it's used. Color coming off on your hands, if extreme, is probably dye, but if it's a lesser transfer, then it might or might not actually be dye and just the leaf itself. And sometimes dye doesn't come off - take the most famous dyed cigar: Partagas Black - they boil those leaves, that color will never rub off on your hands. So, unfortunately, having something come off on your hands isn't always a reliable indicator. Although, if it makes you feel better, the dye is typically made from the stalks of the tobacco plant and not some batch of artificial junk.

Wow. Thank you, Professor! Seriously, there is a lot of very useful information in your post.

[T.G]

BTW, just because a cigar is inexpensive, doesn't mean that the manufacturer is cheating on the maduro leaf.

I would recommend not worrying about it. If you like the cigar, smoke it and buy more. If not, then don't. You're not supposed to analyze your cigars, you're supposed to enjoy them.

[The Poet]

Originally Posted by T.G

I would recommend not worrying about it.

Don't go all Oliver Stone with conspiracy theories.

[ColdCuts]

Originally Posted by T.G

I would recommend not worrying about it. If you like the cigar, smoke it and buy more. If not, then don't. You're not supposed to analyze your cigars, you're supposed to enjoy them.

Thanks for all the good info, Adam. I'm not overly worried about it, just curious and thought it'd be fun and/or educational to gab about it. I do enjoy my cigars, thank you, but figured if there is a place to enjoy cigar analysis, CA is it.

[shilala]

Adam called it. I've had Colorado maduro and Oscuro wrappers that are just as light as a corojo, and they're spectacular.
Litto Gomez Diez is an example of excellent light maduro and oscuro wrappers. Rocky Patel is a good example of wrappers dragged through dye and molasses.
It's nice to think that a maduro is going to be nice and dark, but it doesn't have to, not at all.