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technically speaking, probably not, since mma is mixed martial arts, and kickboxing is just 1 discipline of said mma. Although k-1 does have mma events, the grand prix isn't one of them, but it's still awesome to watch and talk about .:)

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Yeah it is fun to watch because some of those guys cross over to mma. I saw Overeem devestate his oponent in the 1st round of the grand prix.

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A few thoughts about last nights fight:

Brock was in more trouble against Carwin, but for some reason that fight wasn't stopped.

Lesnar needs to start training with a top notch team. He should be a dominant wrestler, and just isn't.

Dana looked absolutely pissed off putting the belt around Cain's waist, so I'd expect Brock back in a title match sooner than later.

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... i didn't think so...from what i remember

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I agree. Carwin had full mount but his shots weren't getting through. Carwin also didn't cut Brock.

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Maybe it's just me, but I didn't see anything substantial that seemed like Lesnar should have been badly hurt. The guy's cardio is horrible and once he's challenged at all, he loses it completely and fights back like a girl.

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Yeah, he didn't cut him, but he was in almost the same position. Taking hammer fists and not making any attempt to get out of it.

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Brock's major problem is his stand up defense. He goes into panick mode when he gets hit. And I don't think his cardio is one his strengths.

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hes so big cardio is always going to be one of his weaknesses. He just has simply too much muscle to pump blood too for an extended period.

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Agreed! We even saw it in his fight with Couture when he was caught a few times with some stiff jabs. Hell if Couture's dirty boxing almost did him in, what did he expect was going to happen against Velasquez?

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Ricardo Arona is in talks to make his UFC debut before the end of the year. He is only 32, and should be healthy since he's only had 1 fight in the last 3 years. His last fight in Sep 09 was at LH.

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Anybody watching the M-1 Challenge 21 right now? Its streaming live from St. Petersburg :tu

:bx

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Ok, I'm not terribly familiar with Russia's Team Legion... but after watching this event it made me go look up videos of Magomed Shikshabekov. This guy has heart!

He came out strong and aggressive against a tough competitor. He ended up catching a beating for 2 solid rounds. However, the entire time he kept his aggression up, worked diligently from the bottom and threw just as many strikes as he ate. Not to mention the multitude of submissions he attempted. He came back in the third but ended up losing the decision when it went to the judges. Still though, the guy looked great and never stopped pressing the action.

I'll be watching more of him from now on.

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UFC and WEC Merg! http://www.mma-hive.com/mma-videos/u...ger-video.html

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Holy crap this is going to bring some interesting fights into UFC!

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I never knew about it. I'm going to start paying more attention to M1. Are they onHD Net?

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I just found this thread. I love MMA i'll keep up with this one. I agree Lesnar needs to work on his skills as a fighter. Or he needs to go back to fake wrestling.

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Bloodyelbow did an article on Brock Lesnar which brought on the chuckles. Someone doesn't think very highly of him :lr

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So who else is looking forward to Hughes crushing Penn this weekend?

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Let's place a bet on it cuz I'm seeing it the other way :)

But to be serious: if penn shows up at 163-165 like he's saying, he's gonna crush. if he shows up at 170 he'll probably be a bit sluggish like we saw against GSP (not that looking bad against GSP is a crime, it's fricken GSP). I don't think Hughes has a quick enough shot anymore to really get BJ down, let alone hold him there. I also don't think his footwork is spry enough to keep BJ guessing, which is how Edgar defeated him.

Either way, really looking forward to the fight.

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ufc tonight

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That guy has a lot to offer and potential coming out his ears, but if noone in his gym can step up and punch him like he needs it he'll never get back on top.

Now who's ready to see GSP pound the dogshit out of Koscheck?

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i am very ready - and very looking forward to this

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Man this thread is always dead. Entertaining fights last weekend on the TUF finale and Strikeforce's offering.

GSP vs Koscheck this weekend. Should be fun to watch. Other fights include:
Sean McCorkle vs Stefan Struve
Jim Miller vs Charles Oliveira
Mac Danzig vs Joe Stevenson
Thiago Alves vs John Howard
Dustin Hazlett vs Mark Bocek

I don't know the rest of the fighters enough to weigh in but those above are my picks for the night. :tu

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Just watched Lawler Linland fight..... What a KNOCKOUT!

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I spoke too soon. Daly/SMith Knockout was AWESOME.

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The card for saturdays UFC fight looks like it might be a boring night, but I have been wrong with past events.

I don't think Hazlett has done well his last two fights hopefully he can get the W.

Whats your take on the GSP/Koscheck fight? I'm thinking GSP with a submission by the third round.

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great event imo, and great main event. DOMINATION.

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e3...ku/fitched.jpg

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no love for K1? The Dutch are doing good!

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This is why I quit watching MMA.

http://www.sherdog.com/events/UFC-12...scheck-2-14504

6 decisions and a draw :td. I cannot believe they give koscheck a title shot. He's a horrible fighter. Too many decisions in the UFC. I liked pride much better, there wasn't that unnecessary 3 minutes of sitting on someone before they stood them up. I really think this is why Cro Cop didn't do well. UFC is geared much more towards the wrestler and getting boring decisions.

/rant

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K1 rules :)

If you quit watching MMA because you want only knockouts and subs, i guess it's good that you quit. I also can't believe you're saying Koscheck is horrible, that's just funny, the guy is a fantastic fighter, he got outclassed in a major way by a superior fighter. It's a pretty narrow minded perspective to only enjoy a fight if it ends in a sub or tko. There were some FANTASTIC fights last night from those decisions. I agree that a sub or a tko are exciting, but that doesn't mean a decision is boring, it's not like it was a frankie edgar fight lol. Many of those decisions were great fights! Expand your horizons.

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Ya I'm not into seeing so many decision fights in a night, but we know GSP can finish fights. I think he just wanted to beat up Josh.

I was very surprised to see Dustin Hazlett get submitted!

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I agree with Bill in that UFC Fighters are fighting like they have alot more money in the bank.
That Doesn't mean that decisions are boring.
The biggest problem facing UFC in regards to decisions has been the judges scoring of recent bouts.
The leonard Garcia vs Nam Phan fight from the Ultimate fighter finale and the Riddle vs Peirson fight this past weekend reminded me of why I stopped watching boxing.
I agree Riddle lost his fight, but not by a 30-27 unanimous decision.
I think bias is being shown to the fighters UFC wants to showcase.
Take the Jake shields vs Martin Kampman fight.
Sheilds takes down Kampman, inflicts zero damage, Kampman gets right up, punches Shields in the face, Decision Shields?

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After the leonard Garcia vs Nam Phan fight Dana White said that the judges are in no way affiliated with the UFC. Supposedly they are appointed by the Nevada State Athletic Commission. I was starting to think that the UFC was biased when Bisping was given an easy path to a title fight. In my opinion he did not earn the fight and was given a few decisions that he did not earn.

If the judges are really appointed by the Nevada State Athletic Commission then I guess I was wrong.

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Boxing Judges are also appointed by their respective athletic commissions.
That never stopped them from issuing biased decisions.
One fight I was at immediately comes to mind.
Lennox lewis Holyfield 1
Lewis destroyed Evander and the fight was declared a draw.

Athletic commissions have a stake in the fighting company's success.
when organizations like the UFC bring fights to their towns it usually is a big boost to the economy.
It's the old you scratch my back I scratch yours routine.

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I couldn't agree more that the judging is b.s. That said, if you don't want to go to the judges, either finish the fight, or win decisively like GSP

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GSP doesn't finish fights. He takes zero risks, and I'm tired of hearing at the end of every PPV he headlines "MY goal was to finish him and I fell short" He is as boring a fighter to watch as there is in the UFC. Saturday's jab fest was slightly better than his normal lay and pray tactics. I'm hopeful that he tries that ground and pound crap with shields. Cause over the course of a 5 rounder, he will get caught and subbed.

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I really don't want to argue with anyone here, so please don't think I am trying to.

This is pretty much what I was saying...the decline of the UFC. Judges have made some REALLY bad decisions lately (shogun vs machida 1) and all they are doing is hyping up some newer fighters just for $$$$. Cain velasquez or whatever his name is....he might be a great fighter but he's very new, same with Brock. I hate whenever people mention Brock Vs Fedor. Come on now Fedors like 31-1-1, and Brock lost his 2nd fight and a couple more. Fedor would eat Brock for a mid-morning snack.

That said, it is a shame. I really enjoyed watching the UFC for a good 3-4 years. It's hard to watch now.

Another side note....

Brock did not EVER pay his dues! He was instantly given TOP fighters when he didn't deserve them. Cro Cop got tossed a tin can Eddie Sanchez, WHO RAN AWAY THE WHOLE FIGHT! My point of course is $$$$$$$$, Brock was more marketable so they give him serious fights. No one knew Cro Cop so they give him all mid level fighters IF THAT, of course he doesn't take it seriously. If I were him I would do the same, they don't take him seriously why not take the free paychecks.

Not to mention the UFC has lost some top notch fighters, Tim Sylvia (hes so boring , but he does win), Snowman Monson, Dan henderson and Arlovski to name a few.

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We are here to argue...:) and I wanted to highlight that part.

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So when GSP was fighting Hardy and had him in that arm bar he let it go because he wanted a 5 round fight?
I'm not defending GSP, but I do remember that fight.

Looking at his record the last couple of years he has no submissions, but I highly doubt he wants decision wins. Last submission was in 2007.






I couldn't agree more.

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I was lucky enough to be ringside for GSP Hardy. How Hardy's arm didn't come completely off was a miracle. From where I was sitting you could actually see the torque on his arm. GSP also had Hardy in a kimora in round 4, again Kudos to hardy. GSP was trying to finish him!

In regards to Brock, He was put In with Mir the first time to make sure he wasn't a fluke ala James Toney and dominated that fight until he made a rookie mistake and got caught in a heel hook. He showed he could fight and earned himself another bout, He then dominated heath Herring. Perhaps a shot against Couture was premature, but he won! He then avenged his loss to Mir. Using Cro Cop isn't a good example. He won his first bout and then lost to a middle of the road fighter Gonzaga and a barely above average Kongo. When he was in against Junior Dos santos he quit on his feet!

In the end UFC is a business and people WANTED TO SEE BROCK FIGHT!
I believe UFC 100 is still the most watched PPV to date with over 1.5 million buys.

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It was awesome to see GSP pick koscheck apart. Boring implies nothing happened, if you're only interested in KOS or subs go watch kickboxing or a grappling match.

Not sure why you'd hate on him for fighting intelligently.

GSP makes top level fighters look like amateurs, but i guess a casual fan like you just wants to see a knockout. I agree that a knockout is exciting, but seeing someone get picked apart by someone with gsp's skill set is anything but boring IMO

After GSP's "BORING" FIGHTS:

http://desmond.yfrog.com/Himg615/sca...=640&ysize=640

http://rdtwot.files.wordpress.com/20..._after_gsp.jpg

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I'm hating on GSP solely because he is always called a great fighter, which in my own admission I don't doubt, but the man is a hypocrite. Ever listen to a GSP interview after a fight. "My goal was to finish off (insert whomever here)"

I understand the Fitch thing. Dude is a bulldog, and doesn't ever give up, and he has superior Jits, so he wasn't going to finish him at all, but take Saturday as an example. Kos had one eye (no depth perception) for 4 rounds, and instead of trying to accomplish his own admitted goal, he stood, circled and threw jabs. There was almost no attempt to anything but jab.

I don't hate on great fighters or fights. Some of my favorite fights of all time have been 3 or 5 round decisions. What I don't like is when the dominant fighter in his weight class doesn't even try to finish anymore.

As for the Hardy, hes tough, I will agree, but if you watch the footage again the armbar wasn't sinched in perfect, GSP's Jits coach even said as much after the fight. As for the Kimura, its anybodys guess, that was in deep and correctly, maybe Hardy's lack of discipline leads to be impervious to shoulder locks.

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For sure, sometimes it seems as if fighter try to win the rounds and get the decision win. Lately I feel as if UFC has a ton of guys that were wrestlers and woke up one day and decided to be MMA fighters. Get a couple of take downs each round and beat up the guy to get the win.
The last two years I have enjoyed WEC more than UFC because of this.

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I think all fighters want to finish their fights. Why fight for 25 min when you can fight for 2 and make the same $?
I agree GSP didn't take any chances against Kos, but he didn't have to. He also didn't dance or make Kos follow him around the octagon, he stood toe to toe, right in front of him, and fought!

Let's not forget Kos got his title shot by taking down Paul Daley and dry humping him for 3 rounds.

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Agreed.

I haven't even seen the fight but Koscheck has made his career by dry humping other fighters for 3-5 rounds.

I also agree most fighters do want to finish their fights but some of them do also want to grind out the decision. Lyoto Machida and Koscheck come to mind. They don't want to take any chances or really even fight they just want to pad their record with "wins". Then again they really aren't fighters so Dom is absolutely 100% correct.

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My point was Cro Cop gets Sanchez and a 1 fight NOOB gets Mir? That decision was motivated by $$$ and greed. Especially when Cro Cop came off a fantastic Pride career, and I'm sorry I think he beat Fedor if not it was definitely a VERY close fight. Brock came off a 1 fight win vs.....*crickets* MR SHARK!??!?

Brock dominating Mir......Eh, maybe but for what less than 3 minutes? It's easy to run at someone and land a few good shots without thinking about what failure you're setting yourself up for. He got outclassed by a much more patient Mir. Brock is also a classless poor loser, he represents everything MMA wasn't supposed to be.

Brock dominating Herring? Nope Brock sat on herring and maybe threw 1-3 good punches. He even said his goal was to ride it out or just tie him up.

Gonzaga got a good kick no doubt. Kongo kneed Cro Cop in the balls like 3 times. IMO that should have been a DQ or points taken off. How well would you fight or even do anything involving moving if you took 3 knee shots to the nuts?

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Agreed. Lay and pray has become the way to win MMA fights. Which is why I love Fitch. Guy is a superior wrestler, but constantly works beyond ground and pound and is always looking for subs. I think the judging system needs a huge change. IF you take a guy down and do absolutely nothing, don't attempt a sub, don't advance your position beyond guard, and get stood up, the judges shouldn't count the takedown at all. The point is to inflict damage or atleast attempt to finish the fight, and cheesy 3 inch elbows and blocked punches from guard don't really cut it imho.

Kos did beat daly by basically taking him down and not doing much. But he subbed Rumble Johnson, when was the last time GSP finished a fight?

Also, Machida may stand and evade, but lets run down the list of the guys hes flat out KO'd (not just TKO) and its impressive. I seem to remember Rashad Evans buckled over against the cage, and Thiago Silva unconscious after a strike from above.

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HOLY **** AT THAT WEC MAIN EVENT - THAT wAS THE GREATEST MOVE EVER IN MMA

edit: http://i53.tinypic.com/4j3la8.gif

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Still went to decision...


But awesome move nonetheless. I still think Spencer Fisher's flying knee on Matt Wiman was one of the craziest moves I have seen. Wiman wanted a freakin timeout, LOL