Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I have beads in all four of my desktops and they work great. And no need for a elctronic humidifier in a cooler, a fan maybe but beads work fine by themselves.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

:tpd:
Im with Al on this. I have beads in all my desktops and in my vino. Set and forget.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I have some Heartfelt beads and they're expensive. I've been doing research on the Kitty Litter. There are a lot of testimonials about Litter Pearls Kitty Litter. They are odorless, silica, and said to keep rH between 64-65% humidity. They are meant to absorb AND evaporate moisture. I haven't gotten any yet because I'm looking for more info on the micro version.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Mario, just read Shilala's post. You need 9 to 17 times the amount of kitty litter and you need to replace te kitty litter every once in a while. In the long run beads are much cheaper and take less room in your humidor.

And btw, I don't think the beads are expensive at all.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I've read so many posts about "kitty litter" vs "beads" that I can hardly believe that anyone wouldn't pay to have beads in their humidors. I bought a pound of beads over a year ago and they work perfectly and the only maintenance is that I spray them once a month. They are self regulating, they work, I only keep a hygrometer to keep my OCD under control. I'm sure there will always be this debate and for me I go along with the majority on here and say to buy yourself some beads and relax and you won't have to worry anymore.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I know I'm in the minority here, but I'm not a big fan of beads. They take up a lot of space and are slow to release/absorb moisture.

I use plain old floral foam rectangular humidifiers in my coolers and 100 count, and a Cigar Oasis in each of my wine fridges.

Granted, neither one of them absorb humidity like beads, but I set the level on the Oasis lower than I actually want it, and when the humidity gets low in the coolers/100 ct I just put a little bit of water in the foam humidifiers instead of soaking them. I'm gonna take a quick peek at my readings.

100 count -- 63% humidity
Cooler #1 -- 66% humidity
Cooler #2 -- 69% humidity (gonna leave it open for a few minutes ;))
Fridge #1 -- 62% humidity (Cigar Oasis unplugged for over 1 month now)
Fridge #2 -- 67% humidity (Cigar Oasis unplugged for over 1 month now)


You can get the old school rectangle humidifiers on c bid for $3.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I'm not getting consistent, constant average RH with floral foam and distilled water. Granted, it's probably my technique ... I should add less water and do it more often probably.

Anyway, I'll add water to the foam and my humi will go from 62% up to 72% or 75% overnight, then I'll take the foam device out and over the next two weeks it will creep down to 62% again and I'll add the humidification device and start the process over.

It seems that every time I smoke a cigar when the humi is between 70% and 75% I get a bad smoke; won't burn right, won't stay lit, is a little harsh tasting, burns hotter 'cause of the relights, touchups and harder drawing.

What I want is consistent 65% RH with low maintenance. I believe I need some beads. ;)

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

From folks you trust?

I'm just sayin'

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I originally used the floral foam and had massive fluctuations, similar to the ones stated above, then I tried the kitty litter pearls and they worked a little better however still not very consistent (took a long time to get the RH up high enough) now I have a 1 1/3 pounds in my vino and a small container in my 100ct desktop and I rarely have to ever touch them and they rock a consistent 64%-66%.

For me it was completely worth the money, I am busy enough with school and work and family stuff to have to constantly monitor my RH. just my :2

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

pnoon,
You've got a good point there. It's information I picked up here and there but nothing from anyone I know or any sources I trust. I did look at the information from the Little Pearls Kitty Litter website and the information there seems to point to it being okay. I may end up just getting some more Heartfelt myself though becuase th ones I have in my wineador just aren't enough.
Wouldn't it be nice though if the Kitty Pearls do work?

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Of course the "information there seems to point to it being okay". They want you to buy it.

:tu to the Heartfelt beads

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Heartfelt it is!

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

http://blog.wasteindustrysite.com/th...eap-litter.jpg

;s

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Kitty litter will absorb moisture(humidity) that is what they were designed to do. But they WILL NOT regulate or release moisture at a set level. Though they are both the same product chemically. Kitty litter has not been treated to regulate at a specific RH. I believe kitty litter will work well in high humidity areas, but out here in Cali. Heartfelt beads are the best way to go. :2

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

This was my experience with the Exquisicat (sp?) from PetStupid.

Very erratic moisture release, I ended up having to use about five times more of the stuff than what I would be using for heartfelt beads, and it still sucked. This pretty much jives with what shilala posted earlier in this thread.

Oh, and the stories about "training the beads" by putting them in a 65% environemnt then removing them, then putting them back... LOL. Basic understanding of chemistry on so much as a highschool level should tell you that such theories are nonsense.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I'm still getting Heartfelt just to keep it simple. But did you use the Pearls or the non tracking kind? If it wasn't the pearls then it wasn't the right kind anyway.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

It was the pearls.

http://video.zootoo.com/prod/146000/...rod_146665.jpg

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I just read what I wrote, and left out a biggie.
"Propylene/water hydrated SAP doesn't adsorb water" is a large point.
If for some reason the ambient RH around a humi is greater than 70%, there's great potential for problems, especially if a humi is leaky.
If someone lived in Arizona or the desert or up in Siberia, it's an excellent choice because those humis require a lot of available water.

The reason Mark and Dave's beads work so well is that they have a component that regulates the water output (via principles you can see in a lot of papers, including those written about hydrated aqueous salt solutions and denatured alcohols), as well as an adsorbative component, which is the unhydrated silica gel.
When cared for properly, they'll regulate humidity in both directions, as they're intended to, and they'll do it very well.
That's why it's so important not to "overwater" the beads. If you do, you've effectively turned the beads into the same thing as a SAP/Glycol combination or worse. Too much water on the beads and you've basically created a bowl of water. That's why it is SO important to read the directions, follow them, and ask questions.
If we don't understand "how they work", it leaves a large margin for error, and we can easily undo the bead's efficacy.

My beads don't work quite like Mark's or Dave's. There's no salt or chemical component in them that regulates evaporation.
They rely on the principle of equilibrium, tons of math, and a well sealed humi. They also rely on a "care" regimen that's designed to remove human error. They also take advantage of an adsorbative capacity that's far in excess (greater than 800% per volume) that of Mark or Dave's beads.
By not having any additives, there's just more room. The structure of HCM beads is much different, too. That allows for a far greater amount of water to be present in them.
Their structure also allows a much higher covalency (electrical charge) that pushes water back and forth between the beads and their surroundings.
Another think is that HCM bead's internal structure allows for a much higher level of depracation, meaning they won't crack or break down over time. There's no reason why they won't last forever when maintained properly.
Add to that, the pores in the beads are too small for free hydrocarbons (cigar smells) to enter them, plugging the beads and reducing their effectiveness. The holes are just the right size to gather and store free ammonia, and they have an almost infinate capacity per volume to do so, making them ideal for aging cigars.

Which brings me around to a point...
There are tons of things that work. Some very well.
An individual's choice should involve where they live, how well their humi seals, how well they can (or want to) follow instructions, and education.
Sean made excellent points earlier. I could use his sweater and control the RH in my humidors using it, a bowl, some water, and salt.
I use my beads because it's easier.
If I weren't using my beads, I'd be using Mark's or Dave's. :tu
I hope this helps!!! :)
Scott

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Shilala,

I have some Heartfelt beads in my wineador right now but I don't think there are enough. I open it daily at least once per day. I kind of want to keep my humidifcation devices uniform. Since I'm opening it daily do you think using your beads or more of Heartfelts will be better. What do your beads even look like? I haven't found them anywhere.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I have Scott's Beads, and they work excellently. They are extremely simple to use. Put them in your Humi and forget they are there. If you want to change the RH that they are calibrated for, he provides instructions. Many people on CA use the beads and swear by them.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Yeah as they all have said, I was looking for alternatives on cigar beads. Just front the money now and be set for life. Its NOT that much when you think of it. Sure if you can use a cheap water pillow in a mini humidor do that, but when it comes to vinos, coolers or larger humidors I would get beads. Cigarmony is running a deal now, and their lb beads come with a free mesh bag.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Thanks for the heads up. I checked them out and they're more expensive than Heartfelt for oz and about the same for a lb. They look cool though.
I couldn't find the right kitty litter pearls at any of the local pet shops until a few minutes ago. I stopped by a new shop on the way to a store across town and they had the 4lb bags of Litter Pearls Kitty Litter for $10.99. I grabbed one for the hell of it and I'll try and run some tests later on in the week. For $10.99 it's worth an experiment.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

You can never have too many beads.
Dave's (or Mark's) beads will do the job for you. You just have to follow his directions.
Depending on how old they are and how you have them distributed, and how often you've added water, and what size your winador is, and whether you have your drain plugged (you better), you can make a decision on what to do.
If you want to talk, send me a pm and I'll send you my cell number.
You can also start a thread and the guys will help.
Most of the guys here know more about my beads than I do. I just invented them. :) Literally, it's all the guys here and at our old home (Club Stogie) that helped me create them. They did all the field testing and gathered data and reported back to me, and it's honestly been a group effort from day one. Without all the guys, I'd have never been able to create them.
I usually do suggest that you keep your beads uniform. If you're using Dave's (or Mark's), I'd strongly suggest you keep using them.
The reason for that is that I've never done any tests to see how the two beads work together. Add to that, they are both brothers of the finest order. I do believe their beads are the identical product and directly interchangable, but you'd have to ask them to know for sure.
A side note...
Mark has supported me and helped me all along the way, too. It's not often you'll find a guy who's so decent and kind that he'll help someone who's creating a competitive product. Show's what kind of person he is.
He's far more interested in his brothers than making money.

The point of all my "blah" earlier is that I (or we) need a lot more info about how you are "doing things" to help you make an informed decision. It's what I was blathering about earlier. :D

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Suit yourself...


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zcAOwP2MFP8&NR=1

:banger

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Cute. Real cute. Nice vid either way though.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I could have dug up all the test data and saved you eleven bucks and a lot of time. :)
You have to precondition the beads prior to using them, too.
You can do that by putting them in an ambient RH that's the same as whatever you wish your setpoint to be, it takes time.
You can also do some mathematical calculations to figure out roughly how much water to add to them to yield a specific RH, but it takes them forever to equalize and become usable.
Simply put, they're a real pain in the butt. :)
I know where you're coming from though. You'll have fun messing around. :tu

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Thanks Shilala. I still want to try out your beads some time I think. I'd also like to see what they look like. I heard something about clay? Eventually I'll need more of somebody's beads after the multiple expansions I'll inevitably do.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Heck, I could save Mario the $10 and still give him the joy of playing around, by giving him a the half to two-thirds full container of the Excussicat LP's that I have out in the garage. Back from when I listened to some moron who said they were the same.

Mario, LMK if/when you're coming to one of the area herfs, I'll bring them for you if you want to play. I've got no use for them.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Thanks TG. I might just take you up on that.:tu

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Yeah man, I'm hard headed about not searching enough. But dont be hard headed about these beads. They are deff worth the money up front for something that will last... well forever. your cigars are expensive, why settle for something inferior to what is needed to maintain their beauty?

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I hear ya and I already have a half pound of the Heartfelt beads. Just imagine if you can get 4 lbs for $10 instead of 1/2 lb for $20+sh? The brand I got looked almost identical to the Heartfelts. It's just a thought. I don't think I really need any more beads now that my Humi is semi-stabilizing, It's great to hear all of the good comments about this subject though. I've certainly learned a lot from all of you in like a day.:D

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Just LMK when you're going to one of the area herfs, and if I'm going to be there too, they are yours. :tu

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I have a pound of Scott's beads in my little 9qt and once they stabilized they have been holding steady ever since. after a couple of months if think one of my hygros from the other humi is off I just place it in the cooler and it reads what the beads are rated at.

sooooo, Scott, when you gonna be making some more beads (nudge, nudge) :D :tu

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I keep asking about Scott's beads. Can someone show me a friggin' pic or throw mw a link or something?! Please?:rolleyes:

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Scott=Shilala, he is a member here. You can drop him a PM. :tu

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Cigarmony is good to. When I contacted scott he said he was out of beads for now:(

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Been using the EXQUISITE CAT unscented for years and works ( holding at 65) just fine. Mayeb it's cause I live by an ocean ..I just knw it works

Rob :tpd:

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Isn't anyone into the cigar oasis anymore?

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

here ya go Mario :tu, this was the FS thread he had a few months back.

http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=19160

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Thanks Greg. This is exactly the info I was looking for. Very nice stuff this seems to be. Very nice indeed...

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

I like Heartfelt Industries beads. Dave Asp is a great guy to deal with and his products are legit. :D

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Ditto! :tu:tu

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

ive been using kitty litter for 2 years in my vino's, and i have had ZERO problems.. and my cigars taste FINE :)

interesting discussion though..

I will attest that the kitty litter RH can either be really high or really low, but have some patience, add some beads/take away beads, or add water/take away water. its a learning curve; but in the end, it "works"

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

He made a fresh batch. Get 'em if you want 'em.


http://www.cigarasylum.com/vb/showthread.php?t=25949

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Why have patience and suffer through a learniing curve when the beads will give instant gratification?

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

:tu

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Thanks for the heads up. I now have 3 of his 8oz bags and a bunch of HF beads too. I'm still interested in the KL beads thing though. TG gave me 1/2 a jug of the Equisicat pearls and I'll try them out eventually when I get a bigger cooler. This way I can transfer all of the contents to the bigger cooler and use the smaller one to experiment with.

From what I've seen so far, Scott's beads need no maintainance, whereas the HF beads do. I have Scott's beads as the primary humidifying source in my vino's and the HF beads to recycle any drippings from condensation. I use HF in my cooler.

I don't think there is anything out there that can duplicate Shilala beads. Silica is a different story though.

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

You need a bigger cooler?:hb:r

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

because i needed a good amount of beads..

id be lying if the main cause wasnt money.. i rather pay $12 than $150.. Call me cheap, but i rather spend it on cigars (and trust me, i do)...

my storage has been perfect, and many will attest to it....

Say whatcha want guys

Re: Cheap alternatives to "cigar" beads?
 

Bob!!!!!!!!!!!!!:mad: I'm still recovering from the last cooler you guys got me! I also have pics and still need to post a thread about your little ambush...