Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Oliva isn't getting any less popular, they aren't turning out worse product and they certainly aren't on the decline. Will some people undoubtedly stay away from them over this? Maybe, but I doubt that the allegiance to Sam runs that deep. Would there be such an uproar if a sales rep for Oliva had left under bad terms and was trying to go to a different company?

If Sam has to take 5 years off, I have a feeling many will forget who he even is. He was never his own brand, but rather the face of Oliva's lines. Their marketing department chose wisely when they picked the 'rockstar' look and started the NUB Live tour (which was copied by other companies).

Will he see success from his 'own' brand (to be marketed by Torano)? That is yet to be seen, but undoubtedly he wants to capitalize on the momentum created for him by Oliva and the longer he has to wait the tougher it may be.

Again, if the split from Oliva had been amicable we might not be even discussing this. Something must have occured on one side or the other that the relationship between company and (ex-)employee must have been strained when he left/was asked to leave. :2

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

good, then we agree

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

I concur that some MAY stay away, but not nearly enough people to negatively effect Oliva in the short or long-term. :tu

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

A lot of those are nut swingers that thought sam was their friend. Sam hated being at shows hated being away from his family...and IMO smoked way to much pot.

People are delusional if they they Samn TRULY created nub and cain. He NEVER blended his OWN cigars. He just carried around blanks and wrapped cigars at events.

Did you ever try talking tobacco with him? LOL


I hope this is approved by the courts. All these "I will never smoke another oliva and wait it out for sam" people will forget about him in two years. I really hope Oliva puts out the TRUTH behind all this. I would LOVE to really hear/read what happened.


We all see the negative about this but in actuallity what percetage of cigar smokers are we online from the masses. People really think them not buying two oliva cigars at a show is gonna hurt Oliva. They make an awesome product and continue to innovate which is where a lot of brands are lacking.

Oh well...ending my rant. I think Sam's a douche. He knew what he signed...he has a bunch of twitter followers and facebook fans...so thats all that matters...lol.

I just feel bad for anyone who invested money in him...they should have known better.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

The people on cigar boards are a very, very tiny percentage of cigar smokers. If you ask most smokers who are not on cigars boards who Sam is, they have no clue. Same could be said of Pete Johnson. And, they don't care. To think this will effect anyone's bottom line is silly.

Besides, people say alot things on these boards that are total bs and they like to posture to make themselves look important in their own mind.

Also, a company that produces over 13 million cigars a year is not a small cigar maker.

For me, if Sam would have come up with good blends in non-clown cigar sizes, I might have cared about this.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Call me old fashioned but if you sign a contract that is your word. I hold no ill will for someone trying to make a living but if you said you would not compete for 5 years than you wait 5 years. Without knowing what the agreement is I would not hold anything against Oliva or Sam. Never liked the nubs anyway. Now the V and the new cain daytona thats a different story.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

that is exactly what i'm saying

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

they exist, check http://www.cigar.com/cigars/viewcigar.asp?brand=997

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

In which case those people are ridiculous...Oliva makes a great product and honestly they're just missing out if they want to boycott Oliva products. It won't hurt Oliva's bottom line. I'm betting the majority of cigar smokers don't even know about this whole debacle.

The more the curtain is ripped away the more you realize it's just a silly old man pretending to be the great and powerful Wizard of Oz :2

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

No.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

we're back to this again?

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

I would hardly consider one of the 5 or 6 largest cigar distributors in America a "small company". :sh

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

When emplyees playing front get....

http://www.shootingatbubbles.com/wp-...g-britches.jpg

And try and

http://img3.visualizeus.com/thumbs/1...ab73b644_m.jpg

through taking the notariety that the company paid to create and attempt to

http://u.goal.com/130000/130017hp2.jpg

Then

http://www.conversationmarketing.com/crystal-begs.png

Not only is the corporate support gone but you have to deal with the things you agreed to that made the company comfortable with pumping corporate dollars into promoting you as well as their cigars.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

yes






:D

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

My non-legal view on NCs -it mostly depends on the state, some already have president of not recognizing them legitimate claim by the company or not.
The injunction has no bearing on the final outcome as Oliva is able to show they have a document and the judge agreed so he orders the injunction ... he didn't rule on the validity of the document.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Watch this video and pay close attention at the question asked around 7:30.

http://www.veoh.com/watch/v14156371Y...ccia+Interview

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Between the distribution and farms, Oliva is a giant. This isn't going to hurt them a bit.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

You may be confusing Oliva Cigar Co. and Oliva Tobacco Co. They are not the same.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

You're correct I was, whoops!

I still don't think they are going to get hurt by this. :D

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Oliva Cigar Co also has farms

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

My ininformed opinion on this might be a.) he knew that he had a no-compete and b.) he figured he could stretch it out
with press releases for 5 years kind of like Duke Nukem Forever, always promised, never delivered, then one day there it is.

But again, I have no idea. I DO know 5 years is a long time in the cigar biz and swallows much.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Is it "competing" to tour the country for 5 years, handing out pre-production samples of a product that's not yet on shelves? :r

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Say it isn't so, Greg? :r

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Nice review.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

My opinion on it for all the Boycott oliva people out there, is your not in the middle of it, your not sam and your not the olivas and they are the only ones that know the truth and what is going on. First if i was to boycott oliva what kind of smoke would i be giving up 85-90% of my humidor is oliva products, yes i am oliva/nub/cain/st freak... i love their stuff. Second i have met Sam and i have met Bryan, they are both stand up guys.... But that being said i don't see Bryan or Olivas bashing Sam on there Facebook.... In fact when i asked Bryan about Sam leaving Bryan only had good things to say about Sam, this was like a month or two ago... I think the whole thing is flipping childish, if Sam has 5 year non compete, then that is what it is, he signed it, now man up and honor your word... that is my 2 cent rant...

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Non-competes are almost ALWAYS unenforceable. I work in the graphic arts industry where non-competes are a heavy industry standard and the contracts are usually nullified by a judge due to the many loopholes available. One example would be firing. Regardless if the termination was justified, the company attempting to enforce the non-compete had better be able to prove it was a good firing or the courts will throw it out in the streets. The REASON is: What would stop an employer from 'hiring' you, making you sign an agreement for 3 to 5 years, work you 90 days and fire you? This would prevent you from finding gainful employment in your profession while 'protecting' the former employer from your work being done for his competitor. It's these abuses that make non-competes stupid to sign and difficult to enforce.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Doesn't work like that in real world, bad example. Can you cite one such case?

Look up wine industry non-competes. So far, ALL OF THEM WERE and ARE ENFORCEABLE. In addition, I have yet to meet one winemaker who went back on his word, maybe its an industry thing, but agreements are ALL respected.

Like I said above, and AFAIK, any time a 5 YEAR non-compete is signed (a pretty lengthy time, I admit) there is serious monetary compensation involved one way or another (meaning during/prior to termination or thereafter), make no mistake about it. So, claiming "hardship" is pretty dubious.

Besides, you and some others keep mentioning "firing" as a way of Leccia/Oliva parting ways. Do you know this to be factual or simply guessing? If Leccia left on his own accord, then there is no court around to take his side. And from where I sit it does look like Leccia quit on his own accord and then decided to go the "American way", ie, stupid legal system where judges and juries have no common sense half the time and plaintiffs have nothing to loose by filing frivolous claims.

You don't see Ernesto Carrillo suing General after they paid him years ago to buy him out and he had to sit all this time on the sidelines due to non-compete he signed up front. That is a man of his word. And honor. To me. But it seems my values are skewed judging by some posts in the thread.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Boycott Oliva, ehhh, if you feel that's gonna help Sam, go ahead. Oliva makes some outstanding products that I will continue to purchase. Sam signed that non-compete when he took the job.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Yeah, I'm just gonna go ahead and keep not buying any Sam cigars. That's been working out great and no one seemed to notice. I think I'll keep buying myself some Oliva's from time to time, just like before, even.

I just read this whole thing, and it simply doesn't add up. For Sam to move ahead knowing there was a five year noncompete would be borderline retarded behavior.
The only thing I can come up with is that his stance is that he's in a completely different capacity in this new venture. That could be a decent argument, but he's clearly the pitch-man, which was his capacity at Oliva. Whether he's pitching at his own company or anyone else's, it's still the same thing. I suppose he can argue that it's only a small percentage of what he's doing and it comes with the entirely new job he's created?
I wasted way too many words on this. I feel dirty.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

The thing is, none of us know what is or isn't in any agreements these parties have signed, so it's all just silly speculation.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Agreed. I wasted way too many words. I wasn't busy, so nothing lost. :)

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

ROFLMAO...well put!

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

I think Oliva may have done something legally to get him to keep his mouth shut on the situation to keep the story from becoming too skewed especially with the show going on this week. I know when he first received the court order he was blasting Oliva on Facebook but has since not said a word except asking people if they knew where he could find a job. I would love to hear the whole story from both sides and see how the stories differ but signing a 5 year non compete and than deciding to try and launch his own brand shortly after parting ways is like pissing in the wind in my opinion. Again I would love to hear both sides from the horses mouth.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

me too

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Sam logged in here yesterday. ;)

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

He's not going to comment on specifics as virtually every severance will make them keep their mouths closed on any of these details or be subject to losing said funds.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Absolutely...wasn't trying to be critical of Sam, just pointing out that I am guessing he is aware that we are discussing the issue.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

I am finding it hard to really give a damn. No offense to anyone, but why should I care? There are enough manufacturers and a plethora of cigars I haven't tried yet to keep me busy for a decade if I choose.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Are you speaking of 'Employment non-competes or BUYOUT non-competes?

No such compensations have I seen in my field, nor in any field of a 'creative' nature. Is cigar blending creative? I guess it's a matter of opinion

Where? I used that as an example, only. :confused:

Again, was this a pre-employment non-compete or a corporate buy-out non-compete? Buyout non competes are always enforceable, because it's an agreement between a previous owner/CEO and the new buyer to not go into the field of business that the company they sold conducted. A pre-employment non-compete is getting an employee to agree not to enter in a field in which they would compete with their former employer if they were to part ways. The reason why these are seldom enforceable is because there are too many ways an employee can part ways with his employer.

I am not saying that it's okay and moral for a former employee to violate a non-compete agreement. I'm just saying those kinds are rarely enforceable, especially if the former employee can prove there was no ground for his termination or had significant pressure to leave prematurely. Let's not blur the line on what is being discussed. I have no horse in this race, either way, Just adding an observation that's worth about :2

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

I'm having a hard time believing anyone would put together a 5 year pre-employment non-compete agreement. This smells of severance/buy-out non-compete to me.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

It actually smells more like an iron-clad NUNYA contract disposition to me.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

I beg to differ. One could make an argument that currently 5 pages of server space has been lost. :D

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Don't miss your coupon code with a minimum purchase. ;)

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

:tu

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

I am surprised this thread is still going

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Me too

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

This helps.

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

Ehhhh-heheh ;)

Re: Sam Leccia's Debut on hold
 

100! http://www.letsgokings.com/bbs/image...ing-smiley.gif